Clean and sober

[Ghosts_on_TV]

Your take on people with a weak mind who suffer from addiction is "Fuck em". Got it. Don't need to hear it again, I get it. Thanks for the input.

It's not really about Fuck Em. Just more of "BE REALISTIC"!

Many of these people know what they are doing to themselves and others around them. Death isn't a big deal to addicts. I can say the same thing for my friend that speeds all the time in his car. One day he's gonna kill himself and take someone with him. I can't change that but just accept it.

These two statements suggest a weak mind, alright.  If I think someone I care about is hurting themselves AND might hurt others, I'll do my damnest to help them.

Tracy, sorry your original thoughts have been derailed, TWICE!  I've decided I hate Pinback, whatever the fuck that is.

That's cool. Maybe I should hide the keys from my friend and flatten his tires. Maybe even call the Police on him when I know he's speeding in his car.

...or I can do the opposite and pay all of his speeding tickets and encourage him to keep it real.

Instead of looking in from the outside and give good advice I should just intervene one way or another.
I'll do my damnest to help them.
I'll do my damnest to help them.
I'll do my damnest to help them.

Put down that cheeseburger, it'll kill you slowly but surely ;)

Looking in from the outside and giving good advice is intervening. Sometimes there is nothing you can do and you kind of have to step back and let go, even if you don't really want to. Sometimes you don't. I get your opinion, but with all due respect, its pretty much bullshit. What if your mother was a meth addict? Or your brother had 7 dui's and is still getting wasted every night? Im pretty sure you never had loved ones die or throw their lives away because of addiction, but i might be wrong. I have. I hope I'm not wrong, because if that's your opinion, it'd make you a pretty shitty person, and I'm going to assume that youre not.

[TommyBurnz]

Those people are hard to change been dealing with it since I was a little boy. My Moms been in and out of rehab since I could remember! Its not easy!

[Ghosts_on_TV]

Those people are hard to change been dealing with it since I was a little boy. My Moms been in and out of rehab since I could remember! Its not easy!

Super hard to change.

[johnnYYac]

Your take on people with a weak mind who suffer from addiction is "Fuck em". Got it. Don't need to hear it again, I get it. Thanks for the input.

It's not really about Fuck Em. Just more of "BE REALISTIC"!

Many of these people know what they are doing to themselves and others around them. Death isn't a big deal to addicts. I can say the same thing for my friend that speeds all the time in his car. One day he's gonna kill himself and take someone with him. I can't change that but just accept it.

These two statements suggest a weak mind, alright.  If I think someone I care about is hurting themselves AND might hurt others, I'll do my damnest to help them.

Tracy, sorry your original thoughts have been derailed, TWICE!  I've decided I hate Pinback, whatever the fuck that is.

That's cool. Maybe I should hide the keys from my friend and flatten his tires. Maybe even call the Police on him when I know he's speeding in his car.

...or I can do the opposite and pay all of his speeding tickets and encourage him to keep it real.

Instead of looking in from the outside and give good advice I should just intervene one way or another.
I'll do my damnest to help them.
I'll do my damnest to help them.
I'll do my damnest to help them.

Put down that cheeseburger, it'll kill you slowly but surely ;)

Alright, the one time I get ornery and I overreacted. 

Non Sin, since we're talking addiction and you mentioned speed, I though you meant METH!  My apologies for the misunderstanding and the insult to Pinback.

That said, I think we should respect the spirit of this thread.  If you see little hope in helping those suffering addiction, does that opinion belong in THIS thread?  Reread the first post...

[jones]

Summer in Abaddon is a solid album.

Drugs are bad.

[ALady]

Interesting take on the Amy Winehouse tragedy by Russell Brand, of all people.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2011/jul/24/russell-brand-amy-winehouse-woman

[Tracy 2112]

Duff McKagan's take on it

http://blogs.seattleweekly.com/reverb/2011/07/nobody_chooses_addiction_not_e.php

[capt. scotty]

Interesting take on the Amy Winehouse tragedy by Russell Brand, of all people.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2011/jul/24/russell-brand-amy-winehouse-woman

Id be amazed if Brand wrote the whole thing, but that was a great read, and fitting with the thread overall.

this San Diago Bro guy needs to find a better thread to schmuck with

[NoVa_NoLa]

Congrats, Tracy!

I meant to post a different article that referred to the same author's book earlier this week, but got side-tracked.  This article popped up on my radar today.  Apologies for the length:

http://caivn.org/article/2011/07/27/neuroscientist-drug-addiction-health-problem-not-moral-failing

NEUROSCIENTIST: DRUG ADDICTION IS A HEALTH PROBLEM, NOT A MORAL FAILING

by W. E. Messamore
Wed, Jul 27th 2011
In a recent interview with NPR, David Linden, professor of neuroscience at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine and the chief editor of the Journal of Neurophysiology, discussed the contents of his new book, entitled The Compass of Pleasure, and spent a fair amount of time explaining the science behind addiction, which he says is a health problem, not a moral failing.

During the interview, Linden explained that addictions to certain foods, behaviors, and drugs are a measurable, physiological phenomenon that occurs in the brain. It's also heritable-- it can be inherited through the genes from one's parents: "There are variants in genes that turn down the function of dopamine signaling within the pleasure circuit." Why is this important? Dopamine signaling is how the brain rewards the body for engaging in behaviors that-- in moderation-- are not only healthy, but necessary for survival, things like eating food, exercising, and having sex. The human machine is "wired" to pursue pleasure, and when its pleasure pathways are working properly, this leads to healthy, functional behavior. But people with blunted dopamine pathways can't experience the neurological rewards of healthy activities the same way others do. The result is pleasure-seeking behavior that takes healthy activities to the extreme, as in the case of overeating or sexual addiction, or even the use of drugs to fire up the brain's reward pathways. Ironically, Linden says, addicts don't enjoy the object of their addictions as much as non-addicts:

     "In order to get to that same set point of pleasure that others would get to easily -- maybe with two drinks at the bar and a laugh with friends -- [an addict would] need six drinks at the bar to get the same thing."

Interestingly, it is because addicts enjoy their addictions less, due to blunted dopamine systems, that they need them more, and with a desperate drive to achieve a normal dopamine response, they engage in risky, excessive, and unhealthy behaviors. This, Linden argues, is an illness, a problem with a person's health, not a moral failing in need of criminal correction:

     "Any one of us could be an addict at any time. Addiction is not fundamentally a moral failing -- it's not a disease of weak-willed losers. When you look at the biology, the only model of addiction that makes sense is a disease-based model, and the only attitude towards addicts that makes sense is one of compassion."

When pressed about the ramifications of the neuroscience behind addiction for public policy, particularly toward drug addiction, Linden asserts that: "Simple possession should never be dealt with predominately in the penal system. It is a medical phenomenon." He goes on to compare it to heart disease. If someone has heart disease, they have certain responsibilities to take care of themselves, and if they don't, "it's not society's problem, it is your own darn fault." Likewise, Linden says that someone who has a problem with their brain has certain responsibilities to minimize the impact and take good care of themselves, just like someone who has a problem with their heart, and that neither should be treated like criminals or incarcerated for their health problems.

It's something we've been hearing more and more from politicians like New Mexico's former Governor Gary Johnson, and Philadelphia's DA Williams: the most compassionate model, and the model with the most empirically-validated success is treating drug addiction as a health issue, not a criminal justice issue.

[TheBigChicken]

Stevie Ray Vaughan Performs "Tightrope" on "The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson" - 1990       this song is all about defeating and facing your demons. I've faced so many in my life and struggle every day. It can be a really lonely and low feeling sometimes. I've lost many good friends to addictions. If any of you ever need a shoulder to lean on I'm always here....

[tdb810]

Stevie Ray Vaughan Performs "Tightrope" on "The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson" - 1990       this song is all about defeating and facing your demons. I've faced so many in my life and struggle every day. It can be a really lonely and low feeling sometimes. I've lost many good friends to addictions. If any of you ever need a shoulder to lean on I'm always here....