Who agrees?
There is no comparison, and I mean NO comparison. Not because one band is better than the other... they both bring entirely different music/atmospheres to the table.
I am a huge phan as well as a huge fan of MMJ and there's nothing to < or >.
i agree that there is no comparison, but to the degree that phish will never make me feel what i get when i listen to mmj
is this thread for real?? but seriously...is it? :P
tires are the things on your car that make contact w/road
silly thread. sorry.
yeah, you can not compare the two like that. its not even in the same realm of music.
::)
I agree that there's no comparison as far as the two bands being *completely* different, but I will say that after seeing Phish 70+ times and not seeing them since 2003, seeing MMJ live at Bonnaroo brought back a feeling that I thought had disappeared with Phish.
Again--not a comparison of the bands, but there are similarities in the energy and tightness of their shows.
Phish=suck a$$ hippie music
Phish=suck a$$ hippie music
I'm sorry that's a little strong, I don't want to offend anyone,
but maybe when your music attracts girls who's closets are filled with overalls and head scarves you suck a$$.
....there really is no comparison, but at Bonnaroo when they were playing all those really awesome covers I was reminded of a Phish show type atmosphere....can anybody get what I am saying with that.....
Quote....there really is no comparison, but at Bonnaroo when they were playing all those really awesome covers I was reminded of a Phish show type atmosphere....can anybody get what I am saying with that.....
Yeah, absolutely. The crazy-cover-bust-outs were always my favorite part of Phish shows--as much as I loved *their* songs, it was also fun to have them as kind of a random-ass jukebox that occasionally plays one of your favorite songs. . .
Both bands cover some of the same songs ("Oh, Sweet Nothin'," " Loving Cup.") which also, obviously add to the covers giving the shows a similar feel.
Quote....there really is no comparison, but at Bonnaroo when they were playing all those really awesome covers I was reminded of a Phish show type atmosphere....can anybody get what I am saying with that.....
i would say this is the only close comparison WHAT SO EVER...other than that, no go. 8-)
With the vocal contribution that comes with EU, I'd like to see some random acapella. The difference would be that the MMJ members would have some harmony and vocal range.
If PHISH could make 'my sweet one' sound good, just think of what Jim, Bo & Carl could do together.
Phish had better drugs at their shows...
QuotePhish had better drugs at their shows...
Really guys? Phish? These are the reasons I've been staying away from the forum.
FLUFF HEAD (but seriously, are we still acknowledging this thread?) lol
Quote(but seriously, are we still acknowledging this thread?) lol
Why not? Despite what can be considered ignorance in the simplicity of the title, discussing the two bands together makes a lot of sense. People feel *very* strongly about both bands and I find it rather interesting that while many Phish fans *LOVE* MMJ and vice-versa, there is also an *EXTREME* backlash when you bring up either name in the other's community. I think it's bizarre. Only a select few individuals seem to have the ability to discuss these bands in the same conversation without resorting to infantile tactics.
what's the connection--they both play covers? is phish not able to be pegged into one category? i just can't see where the focus is ever about the music when it comes to bands like Phish--not saying they're not great musicians....it's like 20% music and 80% live shows...IMO...i know many will disagree..i'd rather compare MMJ w/fearless bands like radiohead or with ryan adams...weaving in and out of genres, really discovering different kinds of sounds--it's just hard for me to relate when it becomes all about that live show, that experience, rather than the art itself...i think MMJ has a great balance of the two...i just don't see the connection but i know many can so i will back off and let you all discuss. i just think it's a random comparison and i hate any comparison that slights MMJ
QuoteQuotePhish had better drugs at their shows...
Really guys? Phish? These are the reasons I've been staying away from the forum.
Phish>RealDeal
Run like an antelope out of control
set the gearshift for the high gear of the soul
you gotta run like an antelope out of control
this would be a fun song for MMJ to cover, one must admit.
Quotewhat's the connection--they both play covers? is phish not able to be pegged into one category? i just can't see where the focus is ever about the music when it comes to bands like Phish--not saying they're not great musicians....it's like 20% music and 80% live shows...IMO...i know many will disagree..i'd rather compare MMJ w/fearless bands like radiohead or with ryan adams...weaving in and out of genres, really discovering different kinds of sounds--...i just don't see the connection but i know many can so i will back off and let you all discuss. i just think it's a random comparison and i hate any comparison that slights MMJ
You're absolutely on to something there--both bands are indefinable. Phish played everything from jazz to bluegrass to Sinatra covers. They played with Jay-Z in Brooklyn, they played Led Zep songs, they have a *HUGE* catalogue which makes it impossible to define what they are (which, I believe, is why so many people simply opt to call them a "jam band.")
With that said, the connection you say you can't see has more to do--at least for me, someone who does see the connection--with the way the music (particularly live) makes the listener feel. For many people, seeing Phish live was about bringing so many interests and experiences together in one place and just letting loose and enjoying the pure bliss of music. Again--for me-- MMJ is the only band that's been able to procure and conjure those same sorts of emotions.
Perhaps it is because of the fact that both bands have such a wide variety of sounds--they are able to replicate so many different feelings that by the end of the show, you feel wonderfully, completely emotionally exhausted.
I'm impressed by the phish fans powers of concentration, to enjoy listening to drug induced somnambulants play the same lydian mode in one position sloppily for 18 minutes
Phish=teletubbies with tambourines
^^We get it. You don't like Phish. Go find another thread to play in because you're wasting your and our time.
I don't see the comparison. MMJ aren't a jam band, have better studio albums that Phish (excluding Billy Breathes and Farmhouse), but MMJ are nowhere near as huge as Phish.
...for Phans....
http://www.musichallofwilliamsburg.com/calendar/show/1853/
....a Trey solo show in this really small venue in Brooklyn, looks like it could be pretty cool....please dont turn this post into why Trey sucks as a solo artist, just letting people know about it.....
Quote...for Phans....
http://www.musichallofwilliamsburg.com/calendar/show/1853/
....a Trey solo show in this really small venue in Brooklyn, looks like it could be pretty cool....please dont turn this post into why Trey sucks as a solo artist, just letting people know about it.....
As long as Trey is off all of his junk, then his solo shows are worth checking out.
QuoteQuote...for Phans....
http://www.musichallofwilliamsburg.com/calendar/show/1853/
....a Trey solo show in this really small venue in Brooklyn, looks like it could be pretty cool....please dont turn this post into why Trey sucks as a solo artist, just letting people know about it.....
As long as Trey is off all of his junk, then his solo shows are worth checking out.
...I think he actually is, but who really knows though.... :'(
Quote...for Phans....
http://www.musichallofwilliamsburg.com/calendar/show/1853/
....a Trey solo show in this really small venue in Brooklyn, looks like it could be pretty cool....please dont turn this post into why Trey sucks as a solo artist, just letting people know about it.....
i saw that---! i thought they were getting back together? i actually liked trey's first solo album---
QuoteI don't see the comparison. MMJ aren't a jam band, have better studio albums that Phish (excluding Billy Breathes and Farmhouse), but MMJ are nowhere near as huge as Phish.
i think they are/were huge because everyone wants to be a part of something---and they took up that spot for many years in the jam scene---people flocking to the shows to relate to others enjoying the same thing...i think for MMJ that is a RESULT of the music, not the cause of the interest---i guess that was my point
QuoteQuoteI don't see the comparison. MMJ aren't a jam band, have better studio albums that Phish (excluding Billy Breathes and Farmhouse), but MMJ are nowhere near as huge as Phish.
i think they are/were huge because everyone wants to be a part of something---and they took up that spot for many years in the jam scene---people flocking to the shows to relate to others enjoying the same thing...i think for MMJ that is a RESULT of the music, not the cause of the interest---i guess that was my point
I'm sure wanting "to be a part of something," as you say, is part of it, but to say that the hype surrounding Phish had less to do with the music than that idea of being something implies that perhaps you never had the "real" Phish experience. The hype--at least the heart of the hype, came from their music. That hype was contagious and individuals who appreciated the buzz more than the music definitely flocked to it, but there was always the undercurrent of buzz that was, as you say, purely "a RESULT of the music."
Phish broke up because they didn't want to be a caricature of themselves. I'm starting to think that the same is true of their audience. Most people are so far detached from the actual Phish scene that all they have to rely on are silly images of what Phish and its universe was all about. I'm by no means trying to bring a "phishier/holier than thou" feel to this post, but it's very difficult to discuss how a band's live experience reminds you of another band's live experience when you have a very limited perspective on what either of those mean.
I'll say it again... PHISH DRUGS > MMJ DRUGS
QuoteQuoteI don't see the comparison. MMJ aren't a jam band, have better studio albums that Phish (excluding Billy Breathes and Farmhouse), but MMJ are nowhere near as huge as Phish.
i think they are/were huge because everyone wants to be a part of something---and they took up that spot for many years in the jam scene---people flocking to the shows to relate to others enjoying the same thing...i think for MMJ that is a RESULT of the music, not the cause of the interest---i guess that was my point
I think you are partly right, although I like Phish's music as well. Times change and in many ways, indie is a replacement to some for the jam band scene. Everything is just so scattered noways musically.
I disagree with you though on your other main point. Yes, Phish took the lead when Jerry Garcia died and the jam scene began to flourish, but Phish had enough substance in their music to fill stadiums tour after tour, not to mention their best albums are still fucking great. I don't like that many Phishheads I've met, but Phish indeed had crossover commercial appeal only dreamed of by their peer bands from the time.
phish=lame.
QuoteI'll say it again... PHISH DRUGS > MMJ DRUGS
....sad but true, lets change that....
QuoteQuoteQuoteI don't see the comparison. MMJ aren't a jam band, have better studio albums that Phish (excluding Billy Breathes and Farmhouse), but MMJ are nowhere near as huge as Phish.
i think they are/were huge because everyone wants to be a part of something---and they took up that spot for many years in the jam scene---people flocking to the shows to relate to others enjoying the same thing...i think for MMJ that is a RESULT of the music, not the cause of the interest---i guess that was my point
I'm sure wanting "to be a part of something," as you say, is part of it, but to say that the hype surrounding Phish had less to do with the music than that idea of being something implies that perhaps you never had the "real" Phish experience. The hype--at least the heart of the hype, came from their music. That hype was contagious and individuals who appreciated the buzz more than the music definitely flocked to it, but there was always the undercurrent of buzz that was, as you say, purely "a RESULT of the music."
Phish broke up because they didn't want to be a caricature of themselves. I'm starting to think that the same is true of their audience. Most people are so far detached from the actual Phish scene that all they have to rely on are silly images of what Phish and its universe was all about. I'm by no means trying to bring a "phishier/holier than thou" feel to this post, but it's very difficult to discuss how a band's live experience reminds you of another band's live experience when you have a very limited perspective on what either of those mean.
I pretty much agree with everything you said. i never really like to put myself in the phish scene. I never cared for dressing like a hippie or using lingo that only phish fans use. Phish was all about the music and sometimes what made phish an essential band would get lost in translation due to there fanbase. Those guys in phish put everything into there music. They believed in the power of music and they were always looking to go into so many directions and explore many different styles and sounds. The feeling and experience of listening to phish was so personal yet so many people felt something out of it and it was great to share your thoughts and feelings with other people who felt the same thing.
So to me phish can never be compared to because they belong in a different relam.
oh i must be in the wrong forum, i thought this was the my morning jacket forum....
seriously, are we STILL talking about this?
take it to the phish forum. please. ::)
No, you're not in the wrong forum, just obviously in the wrong thread.
If you don't want to read it, don't click on the thread--it's simple as that.
There are several other people here who were way into Phish back in the day and had a whole bunch of feelings conjured up when they started seeing MMJ that had been buried when Phish broke up. I don't see why we can't talk about the similarities one band's live experience has with another on the band's forum.
QuoteI pretty much agree with everything you said. i never really like to put myself in the phish scene. I never cared for dressing like a hippie or using lingo that only phish fans use. Phish was all about the music and sometimes what made phish an essential band would get lost in translation due to there fanbase. Those guys in phish put everything into there music. They believed in the power of music and they were always looking to go into so many directions and explore many different styles and sounds. The feeling and experience of listening to phish was so personal yet so many people felt something out of it and it was great to share your thoughts and feelings with other people who felt the same thing.
So to me phish can never be compared to because they belong in a different relam.
And I think that's the common denominator--the fact that both bands so *obviously* put every thing they have into their shows. I've seen a lot of shows but I've never been blown away by a band's--whatever you want to call it, maybe stage presence? Sheer enjoyment of playing?--like I have been with these two. That becomes contagious and the audience feeds off of it. That's when it's an purely organic thing. When the scenesters start to feed off of the residual energy of the audience, that's when problems start and I think that's what you're talking about when you say "what made phish an essential band would get lost in translation due to there fanbase." I've never thought of it that way and I completely agree.
I would also like to say to those of you--pennylane, laylow, itstilljamioe, and others who have been willing to have an "actual" conversation about this--I really appreciate your insights. As the previous poster suggested, this topic has been tried out on PT's (Phish's) message board with disastrous results for the OP, but I'm quite happy to see here that a conversation like this is at least remotely possible. So thanks for letting me get these thoughts that have been stewing since Bonnaroo out :)
i remember listening to a ton of hoist in high school...i also remember when billy breathes came out and especially farmhouse--i actually like them and i think they've written some good songs (down with disease, farmhouse, if i could, prince caspian) and some pretty silly songs--i guess i just didn't see the connection here---for some reason, when i get drunk i inevitably start debating the merits of phish (kind of like did reagan really win the cold war?) it's wierd.
i also remember my ex boyfriend was a regular on the 'dude of life' board---what WAS that LOL
QuoteQuoteI'll say it again... PHISH DRUGS > MMJ DRUGS
....sad but true, lets change that....
It's not what you want, but what you need,
It's not a head full of pills or amphetamines...
dont get me wrong, i love phish. i just dont see the similarities. they give me two completely different feelings when i listen to them. but thats my opinion.....
I've avoided this thread because I find it somewhat silly and, well, ill-informed bullshit that I have heard for years. Phish=Phish and My Morning Jacket=My Morning Jacket. Love it, hate it, but don't be so self-righteous to think that you can value or judge another person's opinion of music. I know a lot of wonderful people who credit Phish for putting them where they are in life (i.e. caring, creative, free-thinking people). It is also MY personal experience that most who dish on Phish never once saw them live, ahem...just sayin'.
"I took a moment from my day
Wrapped it up in things you say
Mailed it off to your address
You'll get it pretty soon unless
The packaging begins to break
And all the points I tried to make
Are tossed with thoughts into a bin
Time leaks out my life leaks in
You won't find moments in a box
And someone else will set your clocks
I took a moment from my day
Wrapped it up in things you say
And mailed it off to you"
Phish were just in it for the money...
I'm a fan of both bands, and I like this thread. Arguing which is better is pretty foolish, but comparing the two and talking about the similarities of what makes them great is definitely worth while. There were a few interesting points brought up here...
-Phish's popularity came from people wanting to be a part of the hippy culture that the Dead had been the center of for so long...There is something to this. A lot of young people love the idea of "the 60s" - the music, drugs, and social freedoms that flourished at that time. A teen aged kid in the 80s who wanted to feel and be a part of a group that he felt represented that spirit could go on tour with the Dead, even though he was 20 years late. Most people went to Dead shows for the GREAT music. There were also plenty of people that were there for the drugs and the spectacle of the scene, to get a taste of "the 60s". The music was improvisational, the light show psychedelic, the whole experience trippy, so it was a fun time, even if you weren't there as a fan of the music.
When Jerry died, Phish was there with a similar experience. I know plenty of people that went to shows just for the spectacle. Some of them turned into fans, and others never returned. A part of Phish's popularity came from people curious for the experience, and wanting to "belong" to the counter culture. But Phish never would've built a following and become large enough to attract the casually curious if they weren't a great band first.
-Phish is only good as a live band, while MMJ is a much more well rounded group, balancing quality in both studio recorded and live material...I think there's some truth to this also. I'll be the first to admit it - Phish has a lot of goofy lyrics. And not to say that they weren't well played and produced, but their studio albums never carried much emotional weight, at times were even comedic (which is not a bad thing). They explored more "serious" themes on later albums, but the full impact of their greatness must be experienced live, imo. And live, they are unbelievable. I'd travel across the country to lose myself in their deep grooves and ride the highs and lows of their live musical genius.
MMJ, on the other hand, has made some of the best studio albums ever, and is one of the best live shows around today, imo. The thing is, there's not one Phish album that I feel emotionally connected to. My connection to Phish is from the experiences that I've had hearing them live and the traveling with friends that I've done to see them. MMJ, on the other hand, is all about emotional connection to their albums first, and THEN their amazing live performances, imo. Jim's voice and lyrics are just so honest, and beautiful, and engaging, and the band as a whole has created these wonderful albums that I'll always turn to like old friends. All that, AND they're a phenomenal live band.
Phish is just a very different band musically, and I appreciate the two bands for totally different reasons. But they've both had big impacts on my life.
...and I can't wait for the reunion tour :D
Does it really matter?
If you enjoy the shows (of either band), enjoy the shows. If not, move along.
I do know one thing, only one of these bands is capable of selling out MSG for a multi-night run within minutes.
And they'll be back next year.
In the mean time, You Enjoy what you are listening to.
QuoteI'm a fan of both bands, and I like this thread. Arguing which is better is pretty foolish, but comparing the two and talking about the similarities of what makes them great is definitely worth while. There were a few interesting points brought up here...
-Phish's popularity came from people wanting to be a part of the hippy culture that the Dead had been the center of for so long...There is something to this. A lot of young people love the idea of "the 60s" - the music, drugs, and social freedoms that flourished at that time. A teen aged kid in the 80s who wanted to feel and be a part of a group that he felt represented that spirit could go on tour with the Dead, even though he was 20 years late. Most people went to Dead shows for the GREAT music. There were also plenty of people that were there for the drugs and the spectacle of the scene, to get a taste of "the 60s". The music was improvisational, the light show psychedelic, the whole experience trippy, so it was a fun time, even if you weren't there as a fan of the music.
When Jerry died, Phish was there with a similar experience. I know plenty of people that went to shows just for the spectacle. Some of them turned into fans, and others never returned. A part of Phish's popularity came from people curious for the experience, and wanting to "belong" to the counter culture. But Phish never would've built a following and become large enough to attract the casually curious if they weren't a great band first.
-Phish is only good as a live band, while MMJ is a much more well rounded group, balancing quality in both studio recorded and live material...I think there's some truth to this also. I'll be the first to admit it - Phish has a lot of goofy lyrics. And not to say that they weren't well played and produced, but their studio albums never carried much emotional weight, at times were even comedic (which is not a bad thing). They explored more "serious" themes on later albums, but the full impact of their greatness must be experienced live, imo. And live, they are unbelievable. I'd travel across the country to lose myself in their deep grooves and ride the highs and lows of their live musical genius.
MMJ, on the other hand, has made some of the best studio albums ever, and is one of the best live shows around today, imo. The thing is, there's not one Phish album that I feel emotionally connected to. My connection to Phish is from the experiences that I've had hearing them live and the traveling with friends that I've done to see them. MMJ, on the other hand, is all about emotional connection to their albums first, and THEN their amazing live performances, imo. Jim's voice and lyrics are just so honest, and beautiful, and engaging, and the band as a whole has created these wonderful albums that I'll always turn to like old friends. All that, AND they're a phenomenal live band.
Phish is just a very different band musically, and I appreciate the two bands for totally different reasons. But they've both had big impacts on my life.
...and I can't wait for the reunion tour :D
Very well put, bbill. I am a little hesitant on the reunion at this point (lets hope they practice...a LOT). However, i am excited to see Gordon rip some phunky shit on the bass at the Aladdin Theater on 8/23.....
Quote
Very well put, bbill. I am a little hesitant on the reunion at this point (lets hope they practice...a LOT). However, i am excited to see Gordon rip some phunky shit on the bass at the Aladdin Theater on 8/23.....
You know, I always thought that Mike looked like Carl's older brother...
(http://cache.viewimages.com/xc/81835971.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1934B869679A269F9CC7E467A0AB61415A75A5397277B4DC33E)
(http://www.jambands.ca/skankfiles/1154472529-Mike_Gordon.jpg)
I love the phish. this is a mighty silly silly thread, though. really.
http://www.dork.tv/view/SNL+Really+With+Seth+and+Amy.html
ps- mike photographs children in tents.
That's it...I'm buying Carl some white hightops for X-mas. Oh, and Carl, you can tuck your jeans into them...
...if you want to, if you want to! ;D