first black president or first woman V.P.

[Penny Lane]

I don't think Obama's point from that youtube bite was to insult or criticize troops - it was criticizing military strategy and policy concerning the "war on terror", specifically that air raids and smart bombs are still going to kill more civilians than terrorists. And Brad is absolutely correct that this war is like the war on drugs, except that it's completely the same! It's an open-ended war, which can not possibly have an ending where one side surrenders. The other side is not a nation or a government, they're just a bunch of disconnected, semi-organized, murderous thugs, and they are not going to just give up. They must be combated as special criminals - you can't expect to end crime, but you do hope to stop known conspirators before they strike, and be prepared to react properly if they do. Invasions and the blind hope of converting other societies to democracy are not going to do a damn bit of good at fighting terrorism - multilateral special operations police forces would be much more effective at neutralizing threats which represent a tiny percentage of civilized population.

Penny, I tried to point out in my post that distributing wealth directly from the rich to the poor should not be the goal of this government, and I think Obama's hope is increase the common good through the means I stated, not just handing the money to the poor. I suppose using more of the wealth from those who can afford it easier than those who can't is somewhat economically socialistic, but it is a far cry from actual socialism, which aims to remove all wealth from everyone and advocates government ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of all goods and services. Also, higher tax rates for wealthier people have been a fact of life since the beginning of income tax in America, at plunderous rates in the 20's and 50's way higher than would be faced in an Obama administration, and under both conservative and liberal administrations. And did the wealthy shrivel up and die from the taxman then? No, they prospered as ever, but hid their money in tax dodges and shelters, which will continue to happen for anyone making enough money to hire a good tax attorney. I would love to see a system where individuals are taxed at the same rate (or not at all) on their income, with taxes on goods and services and proper enforcement of corporate taxes making up the difference, with the complete removal of systems for the wealthy to avoid payment. I view this society as getting what you pay for, and you've got to pay in to get something out, which for me is to enjoy life in what is still the most stable, secure, and free land in the world. Jeez, I sound like a politician. I wouldn't turn down a pay raise or an opportunity to make much more money just because I would be then be paying more taxes, would you?

i agree w/most of that crispy but i think any plan that hands out tax refunds (basically taken from the top 5%) and hands it to everyone else (another form of welfare) is social-"istic"  *i guess not socialism--and yes, this has been done by republicans also-- i think the whole central planning aspect designed to change social/economic levels of people is the idea i'm talking about--i think it can be a good thing (1930s) but it can also be scary to me as a capitalist--it seems like he finds more value in public sector jobs (many times putting down wall street jobs--which btw create more jobs) *oh and the guy worships chomsky, too :D--

[MMJ_fanatic]

I'm not holding out too much hope for MMJfantatic though, he seems to be all about fear and hate.

All about fear and hate huh?
First--I don't hate anyone.  
Policies and anti-constitutional acts piss me off.  Trying to change how America is supposed to work based on fear and misleading claims pisses me off.  People (Obama--see my list in earlier post) who appear to have something to hide are not trustworthy to me.  
As far as fear:  I would hope all my fellow Americans would question policy making that would weaken America in this post-9/11 world--a place we can never go back from.
Please don't confuse questioning and the desire to know everthing about people who desire to run my country with emotions (though I do get emotional about protecting MY income).  But I understand where your outlook on the world comes from, being a teacher and all, relying on a "union" to insure your job security and fight against tests that would measure the ability of teachers to do their jobs effectively rather than allowing illiterate underacheivers to advance to the next grade and the next grade without actually learning anything constructive.  I think you reacted as you did to that child's remark because it was such a brutally honest description of your candidate's position.

[whothrewthecake]

One of my students, who is 7, said that his mom told him Barack Obama kills babies.

Have you read his stance on abortion?

i read his stance on abortion and i don't remember anything about obama actually killing any babies.  :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[

[Angry Ewok]

I think you reacted as you did to that child's remark because it was such a brutally honest description of your candidate's position.

Out of the mouths of babes...

[whothrewthecake]

also i'm having major troubs with some of the hot topics in here. what's deal on this whole liberal school thing? i'm a teacher and i don't really see any evidence of this in the curriculum i am required to teach, nor in the way i talk to the children. i promote tolerance and looking at both sides of an issue. i have john mccain books and barack obama books for the kids to read and think about. this past week, i actually required them to read both at some point and write reader responses to them.

maybe it's because i don't teach that the big g sat down and created the earth. or maybe it's because i teach "science." oh well. i guess we can just eliminate all the real facts and also never say a word about birth control. it worked for bristol palin!

[Angry Ewok]

Yeah, you're right. It's a damned shame she's been punished with a baby.

[whothrewthecake]

Yeah, you're right. It's a damned shame she's been punished with a baby.

yeah, super tight. i'm sure that's exactly what she wished for on her last birthday.

what i think is pretty obvious here is that she definitely did it as a teen. so she def should at least know about wrapping it up. nuff said.

[Angry Ewok]

There's a real possibility she knows what a condom is.

[aMillionDreams]

I'm not holding out too much hope for MMJfantatic though, he seems to be all about fear and hate.

All about fear and hate huh?
First--I don't hate anyone.  
Policies and anti-constitutional acts piss me off.  Trying to change how America is supposed to work based on fear and misleading claims pisses me off.  People (Obama--see my list in earlier post) who appear to have something to hide are not trustworthy to me.  
As far as fear:  I would hope all my fellow Americans would question policy making that would weaken America in this post-9/11 world--a place we can never go back from.
Please don't confuse questioning and the desire to know everthing about people who desire to run my country with emotions (though I do get emotional about protecting MY income).  But I understand where your outlook on the world comes from, being a teacher and all, relying on a "union" to insure your job security and fight against tests that would measure the ability of teachers to do their jobs effectively rather than allowing illiterate underacheivers to advance to the next grade and the next grade without actually learning anything constructive.  I think you reacted as you did to that child's remark because it was such a brutally honest description of your candidate's position.

I knew you would support it.  That is fucked up!  I don't know how you live with yourself but my bet is it has a lot to do with lies and ignorance.

BTW, I don't support the teacher union.  And I agree with NCLB in principal but not in practice.  I see it on the ground floor and since it has been put in effect to has only been detrimental to our schools and I know of not one teacher who has been held accountable for their scores. The only way to effectively do that is to disband the union.

And ewok, I've read the book, apparently more closely than you.  Jesus never mentions homosexuality, Paul does in his letters to the Romans.  If you read it carefully you will notice that it says God himself put homosexuality and other "sins" in the hearts of men to make it possible for his son rescue us from sin.  So how can you blame someone for being a homosexual if God is the one who made humans homosexuals.  It's in the book.  The other place in the Bible it is mentioned is among the other "laws" we don't follow like eating shellfish, women can't wear red on sundays, and  men should not have long hair.  So do you think our boys were an abomination when they rocked out long hair?  Do you think they shouldn't have the same rights as short haired people?  I think it's incredible either ignorant or disingenuous to pick out those passages and ignore more important passages like: judge not lest ye be judged, not one man is without sin, or the sermon on the mound where he talks about compassion for fellow humans, even the ones society deems criminals and sinners.  I think you could stand to read the book again with less hate in mind and more compassion.  Jesus would approve.

[MMJ_fanatic]

He didn't make them homosexual--he allows for that "sin of the heart" to exist in man.  It is up to man whether he pursues them or not.  Punishment is reserved for those who want to pursue that type of lifestyle if you read the words literally.

[aMillionDreams]

so taking the bible literally you believe that eating shellfish is just as bad as homosexuality?  You think long-haired men are an abomination?  But you don't believe: Judge not lest ye be judged? Or did you just forget about that part?

[MMJ_fanatic]

Not judging--simply stating whats there in the Old Testament.  Maybe you think you are qualified to reinterpret the words.

[aMillionDreams]

Not judging--simply stating whats there in the Old Testament.  Maybe you think you are qualified to reinterpret the words.

So you believe that eating shellfish and having long hair is a sin?  Or are YOU qualified to reinterpret the Bible?

[MMJ_fanatic]

Never said so--you keep trying to force words into my mouth.

[aMillionDreams]

Not judging--simply stating whats there in the Old Testament.  Maybe you think you are qualified to reinterpret the words.

So you believe that eating shellfish and having long hair is a sin?  Or are YOU qualified to reinterpret the Bible?

Or more to the point: have you never sinned?  Why do you receive forgiveness and compassion and other sinners don't.  I'm pretty positive that Bible doesn't say that.

[aMillionDreams]

Never said so--you keep trying to force words into my mouth.

You said you reinterpret the bible literally.  that what the bible literally said.  those are your words and the word of god, if that's what you believe.

[MMJ_fanatic]

Never said so--you keep trying to force words into my mouth.

You said you reinterpret the Bible literally.  that what the Bible literally said.  those are your words and the word of god, if that's what you believe.

Um no I didn't say that.  I never mentioned how I interpret the Bible I paraphrased an entry about a type of behavior.  You are really mixed up.

[aMillionDreams]

No, you are mixed up?  You pick the verses out of thin air that serve your agenda and ignore the ones you don't.  So was the Bible just joking when it said Judge not lest ye be judged or are you qualified to reinterpret the Bible?

[MMJ_fanatic]

It does say that, but whats your point about judging.  You trying to say I can't pass judgement on those running for president or something?

[ycartrob]

what gets me is that none of us really know

But, I keep my mind open, or try to.

Mayou Angelou says, "When someone introduces themelf as a Christian, she replies, 'Oh, already?'"

I like that. The Bible mentions LOVE about 50 billion times. But somehow that gets missed.

We're all going to die, and I don't think judging and condemming is anyway to live.