Apparently Jack Bruce does not like Led Zeppelin

[xmascriminal]

I used to hate Zeppelin, and I think I might know why you do. All the stuff they play on the radio is stupid. Black Dog, Rock and Roll, Stairway, Whole Lotta Love, Immigrant Song, all tunes I hate. However, if you really look into their catalogue (and skip the first two albums), you'll see that their music is a lot more diverse than it seems from their hits, most of which are from Zep II and IV. While IV does have some incredible stuff like Battle of Evermore and When the Levee Breaks, I really recommend checking out Physical Graffiti, which contains basically every style they ever worked in. Skip to track three and listen to In My Time of Dying, Houses of the Holy, Trampled Under Foot and Kashmir and see if you still hate Zeppelin.

[ycartrob]

I used to hate Zeppelin, and I think I might know why you do. All the stuff they play on the radio is stupid. Black Dog, Rock and Roll, Stairway, Whole Lotta Love, Immigrant Song, all tunes I hate. However, if you really look into their catalogue (and skip the first two albums), you'll see that their music is a lot more diverse than it seems from their hits, most of which are from Zep II and IV. While IV does have some incredible stuff like Battle of Evermore and When the Levee Breaks, I really recommend checking out Physical Graffiti, which contains basically every style they ever worked in. Skip to track three and listen to In My Time of Dying, Houses of the Holy, Trampled Under Foot and Kashmir and see if you still hate Zeppelin.

I disagree with most of this post. How the hell you think When the Levee Breaks (which is a stright forward blues song) is more "diverse" than Dazed and Confused or How Many More Times (off Zep 1) is sort of silly, IMO.

Hating music is silly, also. And "hating" Led Zeppelin is like hating your parents.

Unless you experienced Zeppelin when it was new and fresh, then of course you will not feel the magificance in it. But it blows away anything that has come out recently, hands down. Those guys helped create modern rock as we know it today, but some of you hate them.

I'd say some of you were born at the wrong time to "get" Zeppelin (and Jack Bruce is a bitter old fart).

[xmascriminal]

I hate a lot of music: Britney Spears and her followers, gangster rap, Love Shack, ect. And if you read my post carefully, I never said that When the Levee Breaks was one of their diverse songs. It's not, but it does destory all the songs on Zep I and II.

[ycartrob]

I hate a lot of music: Britney Spears and her followers, gangster rap, Love Shack, ect. And if you read my post carefully, I never said that When the Levee Breaks was one of their diverse songs. It's not, but it does destory all the songs on Zep I and II.

When the Levee Breaks is filler. It's bad ass filler, none the less, but good grief I don't think you understand how Led Zeppelin I and II blew the lid off things.

If you're suggesting people skip their first 2 albums then I'd say you're missing the boat.

[xmascriminal]

I understand that they're historically important, I just don't like the way they sound. And if When the Levee Breaks is filler, then so's almost everything on those records.

[DavidCrosby]

Some of what you said Crosby is actually true. Zeppelin did indeed steal some music, ideas etc... from blues greats. However, name me a blues legend that didn't "borrow" from their peers or from one or many of their heroes? Plus, I like how Zeppelin used, refined and amplified the music they "borrowed." Jeff Beck is guilty of this too.

However, Carmine Appice is more of a contemporary of Bonzo's and even though both are heavy hitters and looked exactly the same, Carmine played in the abhorent Vanilla Fudge, so your can stop the argument right there.

I agree that JPJ hardly gets mentioned, but I think he wouldn't have had it any other way, kind of on-par with another quiet multi-talented bassist, John Entwistle.

Page was more than just lead solos (and he's far more melodic than you give him credit). His riffs are highly influential and his production techniques were innovative for the time.

No matter what band Appice was in before (you think Vanilla Fudge is embarrasing, he played with Rod Stewart in the 80's), I think that one of the Bonzo trademarks was the double bass peddle and I feel like a lot of the times he is given credit for pioneering it into rock music but I feel like Appice did it first (and for some reason I think I remember Bonham saying himself in some interview I read that he feels like Appice was a big influence on him).  

Now I used to love Led Zeppelin til I was about 17, when I found out that they stole a lot of music, that mad me really dislike them.  Now in the blues genre many people have borrowed ideas and what not, but that is something that goes with the genre, and when old blues musicians were using other people's ideas they weren't making millions of dollars off it.  When other blues musicians from the 70's were also borrowing ides they tended to not put their own names as the songwriters.

The music that Led Zeppelin stole that blows my mind that not many other people know about it songs like, "Stairway To Heaven" and "Since I've Been Loving You".  The opening guitar riff in Stairway that the song is pretty much based off of is stolen from a Spirit song called Taurus.  The worst case of the musical theft is "Since I've Been Loving You".  Listen to the Moby Grape song called Never off of Grape Jam, this is the same song (written by Bob Mosley on Grape Jam in 1968) that somehow was written by Page/Plant two years later in 1970.  So the beginning of the song is sort of a narrative from a man working all night and waiting till he gets home to his women.  In the MG version the lyrics talk of working all night from 11 - 7.  But Led Zeppelin thought they would mix it up a bit and steal the song and screw it up, in the Zep version Plant sings of the back breaking work shift he had from 7- 11 (thats the shift I used to work when I was in high school).  So pretty much they stole the song and screwed it up, lame.

[purvis9876]

Some of what you said Crosby is actually true. Zeppelin did indeed steal some music, ideas etc... from blues greats. However, name me a blues legend that didn't "borrow" from their peers or from one or many of their heroes? Plus, I like how Zeppelin used, refined and amplified the music they "borrowed." Jeff Beck is guilty of this too.

However, Carmine Appice is more of a contemporary of Bonzo's and even though both are heavy hitters and looked exactly the same, Carmine played in the abhorent Vanilla Fudge, so your can stop the argument right there.

I agree that JPJ hardly gets mentioned, but I think he wouldn't have had it any other way, kind of on-par with another quiet multi-talented bassist, John Entwistle.

Page was more than just lead solos (and he's far more melodic than you give him credit). His riffs are highly influential and his production techniques were innovative for the time.

No matter what band Appice was in before (you think Vanilla Fudge is embarrasing, he played with Rod Stewart in the 80's), I think that one of the Bonzo trademarks was the double bass peddle and I feel like a lot of the times he is given credit for pioneering it into rock music but I feel like Appice did it first (and for some reason I think I remember Bonham saying himself in some interview I read that he feels like Appice was a big influence on him).  

Now I used to love Led Zeppelin til I was about 17, when I found out that they stole a lot of music, that mad me really dislike them.  Now in the blues genre many people have borrowed ideas and what not, but that is something that goes with the genre, and when old blues musicians were using other people's ideas they weren't making millions of dollars off it.  When other blues musicians from the 70's were also borrowing ides they tended to not put their own names as the songwriters.

The music that Led Zeppelin stole that blows my mind that not many other people know about it songs like, "Stairway To Heaven" and "Since I've Been Loving You".  The opening guitar riff in Stairway that the song is pretty much based off of is stolen from a Spirit song called Taurus.  The worst case of the musical theft is "Since I've Been Loving You".  Listen to the Moby Grape song called Never off of Grape Jam, this is the same song (written by Bob Mosley on Grape Jam in 1968) that somehow was written by Page/Plant two years later in 1970.  So the beginning of the song is sort of a narrative from a man working all night and waiting till he gets home to his women.  In the MG version the lyrics talk of working all night from 11 - 7.  But Led Zeppelin thought they would mix it up a bit and steal the song and screw it up, in the Zep version Plant sings of the back breaking work shift he had from 7- 11 (thats the shift I used to work when I was in high school).  So pretty much they stole the song and screwed it up, lame.

Bonham did not have two bass drums, nor did he play with two bass pedals. Sorry, I stopped reading after that.

[DavidCrosby]

When the Levee Breaks is filler. It's bad ass filler, none the less, but good grief I don't think you understand how Led Zeppelin I and II blew the lid off things.

If you're suggesting people skip their first 2 albums then I'd say you're missing the boat.

Led Zeppelin only really got popular in the 70's in America really.  Most of their contemporaries disliked them and apparently still do.  So I really don't think that Led Zep I + II were really that important and blew the lid off of anything besides their drug habits.

[xmascriminal]

They were important because, though Zeppelin were not a metal band themselves, the tracks on those records especially helped create a new genre.

[purvis9876]

When the Levee Breaks is filler. It's bad ass filler, none the less, but good grief I don't think you understand how Led Zeppelin I and II blew the lid off things.

If you're suggesting people skip their first 2 albums then I'd say you're missing the boat.

Led Zeppelin only really got popular in the 70's in America really.  Most of their contemporaries disliked them and apparently still do.  So I really don't think that Led Zep I + II were really that important and blew the lid off of anything besides their drug habits.

Dude, I can understand not liking a band, but you are just throwing out bs statements. Seeing how they formed around 69 and ended in 80, yeah I would also say they "only really got popular in the 70s", too. But only in America really? Please show me how they were not as popular in Europe or places like Japan.

[Jaimoe]

Zeppelin actually stole The Yardbirds "Dazed and Confused" version they in-turn stole off a folk singer.

Double-bass? Who cares? The 60's moved at such a hyper pace that someone was going to do the double-bass first, and until today, I thought that person was Keith Moon - at least he made it famous in a rock star sense. Moon remains my favourite drummer and rock star regardless.

The haunting heavy main riff in "No Quarter" is a throw-away Hendrix bridge from "Machine Gun" from the original Band of Gypsies. Jeff Beck turned the end coda from "In From The Storm" into one of his best known instrumentals,  "Rice Pudding."

I don't hate buried thievery for some reason, I just like - and hate - music. I let the lawyers settle that. Elvis was a thief. Bill Haley was a thief. Muddy Waters was a thief. Chuck Berry was a theif. Genesis sucks. I hate The Pet Shop Boys and Depeche Mode (the last two sentences are to see if Tracy is reading any of this).

[ycartrob]

Some of what you said Crosby is actually true. Zeppelin did indeed steal some music, ideas etc... from blues greats. However, name me a blues legend that didn't "borrow" from their peers or from one or many of their heroes? Plus, I like how Zeppelin used, refined and amplified the music they "borrowed." Jeff Beck is guilty of this too.

However, Carmine Appice is more of a contemporary of Bonzo's and even though both are heavy hitters and looked exactly the same, Carmine played in the abhorent Vanilla Fudge, so your can stop the argument right there.

I agree that JPJ hardly gets mentioned, but I think he wouldn't have had it any other way, kind of on-par with another quiet multi-talented bassist, John Entwistle.

Page was more than just lead solos (and he's far more melodic than you give him credit). His riffs are highly influential and his production techniques were innovative for the time.

No matter what band Appice was in before (you think Vanilla Fudge is embarrasing, he played with Rod Stewart in the 80's), I think that one of the Bonzo trademarks was the double bass peddle and I feel like a lot of the times he is given credit for pioneering it into rock music but I feel like Appice did it first (and for some reason I think I remember Bonham saying himself in some interview I read that he feels like Appice was a big influence on him).  

Now I used to love Led Zeppelin til I was about 17, when I found out that they stole a lot of music, that mad me really dislike them.  Now in the blues genre many people have borrowed ideas and what not, but that is something that goes with the genre, and when old blues musicians were using other people's ideas they weren't making millions of dollars off it.  When other blues musicians from the 70's were also borrowing ides they tended to not put their own names as the songwriters.

The music that Led Zeppelin stole that blows my mind that not many other people know about it songs like, "Stairway To Heaven" and "Since I've Been Loving You".  The opening guitar riff in Stairway that the song is pretty much based off of is stolen from a Spirit song called Taurus.  The worst case of the musical theft is "Since I've Been Loving You".  Listen to the Moby Grape song called Never off of Grape Jam, this is the same song (written by Bob Mosley on Grape Jam in 1968) that somehow was written by Page/Plant two years later in 1970.  So the beginning of the song is sort of a narrative from a man working all night and waiting till he gets home to his women.  In the MG version the lyrics talk of working all night from 11 - 7.  But Led Zeppelin thought they would mix it up a bit and steal the song and screw it up, in the Zep version Plant sings of the back breaking work shift he had from 7- 11 (thats the shift I used to work when I was in high school).  So pretty much they stole the song and screwed it up, lame.

sort of funny that this pisses you off so much

[ycartrob]

Hate is a pretty strong word to describe harmless music that other people love.

My brother-in-law (the jazz snob) hates My Morning Jacket.

so be it

[ycartrob]

but seriously, I haven't had a Led Zeppelin argument since 1986 when some twit gutiar player friend of mine (who now sells insurance) said Jimmy Page was a sloppy guitar player. Man, we almost came to blows!  ;D  (I think we both ended up crying and hugging it out).

there was Budweiser involved...  :-?

[purvis9876]

Hate is a pretty strong word to describe harmless music that other people love.

My brother-in-law (the jazz snob) hates My Morning Jacket.

so be it

Of course, if his car brakes were to "accidentally" fail on the way to work one morning, well he wouldn't have much to be snobby about then; would he?  ;D

[xmascriminal]

Hate is a pretty strong word to describe harmless music that other people love.

How about "strongly dislike"?

[ycartrob]

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eueFiMM3AU[/media]

[tomEisenbraun]

Some of what you said Crosby is actually true. Zeppelin did indeed steal some music, ideas etc... from blues greats. However, name me a blues legend that didn't "borrow" from their peers or from one or many of their heroes? Plus, I like how Zeppelin used, refined and amplified the music they "borrowed." Jeff Beck is guilty of this too.

However, Carmine Appice is more of a contemporary of Bonzo's and even though both are heavy hitters and looked exactly the same, Carmine played in the abhorent Vanilla Fudge, so your can stop the argument right there.

I agree that JPJ hardly gets mentioned, but I think he wouldn't have had it any other way, kind of on-par with another quiet multi-talented bassist, John Entwistle.

Page was more than just lead solos (and he's far more melodic than you give him credit). His riffs are highly influential and his production techniques were innovative for the time.

No matter what band Appice was in before (you think Vanilla Fudge is embarrasing, he played with Rod Stewart in the 80's), I think that one of the Bonzo trademarks was the double bass peddle and I feel like a lot of the times he is given credit for pioneering it into rock music but I feel like Appice did it first (and for some reason I think I remember Bonham saying himself in some interview I read that he feels like Appice was a big influence on him).  

Now I used to love Led Zeppelin til I was about 17, when I found out that they stole a lot of music, that mad me really dislike them.  Now in the blues genre many people have borrowed ideas and what not, but that is something that goes with the genre, and when old blues musicians were using other people's ideas they weren't making millions of dollars off it.  When other blues musicians from the 70's were also borrowing ides they tended to not put their own names as the songwriters.

The music that Led Zeppelin stole that blows my mind that not many other people know about it songs like, "Stairway To Heaven" and "Since I've Been Loving You".  The opening guitar riff in Stairway that the song is pretty much based off of is stolen from a Spirit song called Taurus.  The worst case of the musical theft is "Since I've Been Loving You".  Listen to the Moby Grape song called Never off of Grape Jam, this is the same song (written by Bob Mosley on Grape Jam in 1968) that somehow was written by Page/Plant two years later in 1970.  So the beginning of the song is sort of a narrative from a man working all night and waiting till he gets home to his women.  In the MG version the lyrics talk of working all night from 11 - 7.  But Led Zeppelin thought they would mix it up a bit and steal the song and screw it up, in the Zep version Plant sings of the back breaking work shift he had from 7- 11 (thats the shift I used to work when I was in high school).  So pretty much they stole the song and screwed it up, lame.

Bonham did not have two bass drums, nor did he play with two bass pedals. Sorry, I stopped reading after that.

Seriously. Do a little homework. His right foot was the fucking foundation of that band. I will argue that the questioned foot was THE hammer of the gods that everyone talked about. That was one damn foot. You can hear it on The Ocean and Since I've Been Lovin' You. You heard those squeaks? All the same pedal. I'm pretty sure there've been whole books written about the man's right foot. It was massive. Everything about it. And all of rock respected that. Bonham's death was a TRAGEDY, not because no one liked him, but because all of rock realized what an incredible drummer they'd just lost.

And don't get me started on Page. Sloppy? Yes. Virtuousic? Hell yes. The way the man could work his way inbetween styles on the extended jam sessions, could turn things around and solo and just...dammit. Sit down and listen to all 20 minutes of "Whole Lotta Love" from the How The West Was Won live disc from a couple years back and tell me Page is awful. The man could solo like a man possessed. I can't help but respect that.