The RNC

[Penny Lane]

i just wish palin wasn't pro life--she'd be perfect

so you're pro death? so abortion is killing a living human being (ie death)?
please explain.

pennylane's post struck me as surprising because most pro-choice people refer to the opposite position as "anti-abortion".

Although personally I am pro-life, and it is an important issue for me, we have to ask ourselves, is the legality of abortion really the most important issue facing our nation in 2008? I'll admit one of my main cases for why I don't like Obama is because he doesn't support a ban on partial-birth abortions, which usually is supported by both left and right wingers.

No matter who wins, Roe v. Wade won't likely be overturned. We have to remember (disregarding what the commercials tell us) that a president cannot single-handedly reverse a Supreme Court decision. I am afraid of the Justices that could be appointed with a Democratic president that would be confirmed by a Democratic Congress though...

it's a huge issue for me--i'm not going to get into yet another pro-life pro-choice debate (incidentally, i don't call it anything else) and yes, suprisingly it is more important to me than a lot of issues so if it means voting for a liberal, even though i disagree w/most of the fiscal policies... it's as important to me as health care, global warming or the economy. roe v. wade has been chipped away at w/cases like Casey, and i think it was okay to ban certain partial birth abortions--and while i don't see anything happening in the next 2-4 years, i feel like it will happen in the not so distant future...

I don't want to debate either; it's just that most pro-choice people I have talked to do not consider abortion as killing. However, if you're saying you're "anti pro-life", well.... sort of sounds like you are pro-death (ie, killing). For clarity sakes, what's the opposite of pro life? Pro choice doesn't work, b/c what if the choice is life? Then you can be both pro-choice/pro-life. So if Palin is pro-life, then she had to have made a choice (which you support). I am confused.

And I am not looking to debate, just trying to figure out how you can oppose pro-life (in light of abortion not being the killing of another human being).

--if you're using 'killing' in the traditional sense as to end a life--then then i guess you must know when life begins/when the fetus becomes viable. i really don't know when life begins----congress has determined it's at a certain point--that is the reason i don't think of it like that

[pawpaw]

I think that the National Conventions are useless, basically the pep rally in front of the home crowd before the big game. I want to know what programs and policies are going to be supported or cut back, and how things are going to be paid for - and this is never discussed in any detail at the conventions. I really don't care how good of a speaker a candidate is (or isn't)...in fact, I'd prefer it if my president was a mute...just take care of business and keep quiet ;D

At this point, I really don't know who I'm going to vote for. I really like McCain, except he's completely pro-war, and that's a disgusting thing to me. While Obama certainly has been saying the right things, I don't know enough about him to give him the nod. It is a relief though, to have two, good, major party candidates to choose from.

...and Palin is a fine woman ;)  

[ycartrob]

i just wish palin wasn't pro life--she'd be perfect

so you're pro death? so abortion is killing a living human being (ie death)?
please explain.

pennylane's post struck me as surprising because most pro-choice people refer to the opposite position as "anti-abortion".

Although personally I am pro-life, and it is an important issue for me, we have to ask ourselves, is the legality of abortion really the most important issue facing our nation in 2008? I'll admit one of my main cases for why I don't like Obama is because he doesn't support a ban on partial-birth abortions, which usually is supported by both left and right wingers.

No matter who wins, Roe v. Wade won't likely be overturned. We have to remember (disregarding what the commercials tell us) that a president cannot single-handedly reverse a Supreme Court decision. I am afraid of the Justices that could be appointed with a Democratic president that would be confirmed by a Democratic Congress though...

it's a huge issue for me--i'm not going to get into yet another pro-life pro-choice debate (incidentally, i don't call it anything else) and yes, suprisingly it is more important to me than a lot of issues so if it means voting for a liberal, even though i disagree w/most of the fiscal policies... it's as important to me as health care, global warming or the economy. roe v. wade has been chipped away at w/cases like Casey, and i think it was okay to ban certain partial birth abortions--and while i don't see anything happening in the next 2-4 years, i feel like it will happen in the not so distant future...

I don't want to debate either; it's just that most pro-choice people I have talked to do not consider abortion as killing. However, if you're saying you're "anti pro-life", well.... sort of sounds like you are pro-death (ie, killing). For clarity sakes, what's the opposite of pro life? Pro choice doesn't work, b/c what if the choice is life? Then you can be both pro-choice/pro-life. So if Palin is pro-life, then she had to have made a choice (which you support). I am confused.

And I am not looking to debate, just trying to figure out how you can oppose pro-life (in light of abortion not being the killing of another human being).

--if you're using 'killing' in the traditional sense as to end a life--then then i guess you must know when life begins/when the fetus becomes viable. i really don't know when life begins----congress has determined it's at a certain point--that is the reason i don't think of it like that

OK, thanks. I am just trying to understand as many viewpoints as possible.   :)

[Isobella]

If you think  they're two good candidates you have been deluded.
As a dues paying member of the Socialist Party I will vote for Brian Moore, but Cynthia Mcinney of the Greens would be a good choice.
Don't for the republocrat War Parties.

"armies are the enemy of Liberty" Thomas Jefferson

[mjkoehler]

Something that came to my wife, listening to Palin drone on. Palin kinda sounds like Tracy Flick. Kind of has her mannerisms too.

[Penny Lane]

wow!!  great speeches by guiliani and palin! below the belt cuts----she did a great job---the best speech of either of the conventions--i have a feeling that's gonna affect the polls.

[Angry Ewok]

If you think they're two good candidates you have been deluded. As a dues paying member of the Socialist Party[...]

Socialists aren't really known for their good taste in candidates, though, are they?

Don't for the republocrat War Parties.

Instead, you suggest we vote for the "Peace Candidate" that doesn't want to fund our army? That wants to speak with our enemies without preconditions? The same enemies who are almost finished constructing a nuclear warhead with the range to nail the coastal United States? The same enemies who have pledged to distribute that technology to it's terrorist-hoarding allies? The same enemies who have stated, time and again, that the United States is the Great Satan and that the Divine commands we, and Jerusalem, be nuked off of the face of the Earth? The same enemies who are now aligned with the KGB-operated Russians, who control over 30% of European fuel? The same enemies, who only a month ago, demonstrated that they have no problem invading the sovereign territory of a democracy?

"armies are the enemy of Liberty" Thomas Jefferson

A Socialist quoting Thomas Jefferson? Now that is rich. War secures peace. Nobody understood this better than our founding fathers. Liberty is the ability to levy war and conclude peace.


I don't know about you people, but I like the idea of a President who will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic. That's why I'm voting for John McCain.

[Angry Ewok]

wow!!  great speeches by guiliani and palin! below the belt cuts----she did a great job---the best speech of either of the conventions--i have a feeling that's gonna affect the polls.

Nothing that I heard was "below the belt" - everything that I heard was absolutely relevant to the Presidential race, and factual. Maybe the truth just hurts, eh? I agree 100% though that Giuliani and Palin knocked their speeches out of the park! Some of the best remarks,

From Rudy,

"What do you think most other candidates would have done in that situation? They would have acted in their own self-interest by changing their position.

How many times have we seen Barack Obama do that?

Obama was going to take public financing for his campaign, until he didn't. Obama was against wiretapping before he voted for it. When speaking to a pro-Israel group, Obama favored an undivided Jerusalem. Until the very next day when he changed his mind.

I hope for his sake, Joe Biden got that VP thing in writing."

"And as we look to the future never let us forget that - when we are at our best - we are the party that expands Freedom. We began as a party dedicated to freeing people from slavery ... And we are still the party that is willing to fight for freedom at home and around the world. We are the party that wants to expand individual freedom and economic freedom ... because we believe that the secret of America's success is not central government, it is self-government. We are the party that believes in giving workers the right to work. The party that believes parents should choose where their children go to school.

And we are the party that believes unapologetically in America's essential greatness - that we are a shining city on the hill, a beacon of freedom that inspires people everywhere to reach for a better world."

From Sarah,

"I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a "community organizer," except that you have actual responsibilities. I might add that in small towns, we don't quite know what to make of a candidate who lavishes praise on working people when they are listening, and then talks about how bitterly they cling to their religion and guns when those people aren't listening.

We tend to prefer candidates who don't talk about us one way in Scranton and another way in San Francisco. "

"We need American energy resources, brought to you by American ingenuity, and produced by American workers. I've noticed a pattern with our opponent... Maybe you have, too.

We've all heard his dramatic speeches before devoted followers.

And there is much to like and admire about our opponent.

But listening to him speak, it's easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform - not even in the state senate."

"There is only one man in this election who has ever really fought for you... in places where winning means survival and defeat means death... and that man is John McCain. In our day, politicians have readily shared much lesser tales of adversity than the nightmare world in which this man, and others equally brave, served and suffered for their country.

It's a long way from the fear and pain and squalor of a six-by-four cell in Hanoi to the Oval Office.

But if Senator McCain is elected president, that is the journey he will have made. "

[Angry Ewok]

War secures peace, sweetheart.

sweetheart? Bit condescending, don't you think?

Yeah, my bad...

(I've edited it out.)

[ycartrob]

I broke my word and watched the RNC last night; Romney and Giuliani looked robotic. And Giuliani getting on this "ticket" to reform DC is a joke. Whichever way the wind blows folks, just words and words only. He's bucking for a cabinet position; don't forget, these are politicians.

Wasn't Lieberman on the ticket with Gore in 2000, but Rudy is critcizing Obama for changing his mind? Is anyone paying attention to this crap?

And let's not forget 8 years ago when a lot of these Republicans (you know, the flag waving kind that are supporting McCain and his war service) said that McCain "abandoned the veterans" when he returned from Vietnam. And also (the Republicans again) the claim that he was mentally unfit b/c of his POW experiences. Then there were the rumors (from Republicans) that he fathered a black child b/c they knew it would look unfavorable in South Carolina. (This is why I voted for Nader in 2000 and not Bush). But now, he's a hero? They totally shit on McCain, but now it's all good. How does the public forget this shit so easily? This is all rhetoric, top to bottom, both sides. I hate partisan politics. Despise the double talk. It's sick.

I was totally impressed with Palin; she's very likable, smart, passionate and brave. To get up there in front on the RNC and give that speech was amazing. Is she the best Republican choice for VP? Absolutely not.

It's all a good "show", isn't it?

[Penny Lane]

the fact that Palin's husband is a championship ski machine racer is enough to sway my vote!! that is so awesome!! (kidding, but great speech)

[ycartrob]

alas, the double speak   :-/
http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=184086&title=sarah-palin-gender-card&byDate=true

[ycartrob]

we need a REVOLUTION. not just a smoke screen of false hope.

OK, so what's the plan? Are we meeting at the quad at noon?

[crazylove]

we need a REVOLUTION. not just a smoke screen of false hope.

OK, so what's the plan? Are we meeting at the quad at noon?

Great answer.  

[Angry Ewok]

458,658,439th reason why Tracy is pretty much my best friend in the whole wide web.

[MMJ_fanatic]

pennylane's post struck me as surprising because most pro-choice people refer to the opposite position as "anti-abortion".

Don't you know its now taboo to use the word "abortion"?  Euphemisms like "pro-choice" are much more happy and positive sounding than "pro-abortion"

[mjkoehler]

Sorry, couldn't help it. Hypocracy is abound.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=184086&title=sarah-palin-gender-card

[thatswhatshesaid]

i thought i was watching a 4 day long SNL skit or something, except th RNC was actually funny. its amazing how disillusioned the republicans (in general) are. i also like how the mccain camp must think every woman in america is retarded. getting a female running mate? really? not that i have a problem with a female IN THE LEAST, but if they didn't think they could sway disgruntled hilary supporters, there would not be a woman running with john mccain. hypocrisy at its finest.

[thatswhatshesaid]

if they didn't think they could sway disgruntled hilary supporters, there would not be a woman running with john mccain. hypocrisy at its finest.

Apparently it's working.  With white women at least.  Which is unbelievable to me but I guess I'll never understand the stupidity of some people.

Sorry but I think I can live without a Pentocostal possible prez who thinks the Alaska pipeline is God's will.

its pretty sad. what amazes me about the whole thing is that there are some people out there that will give up everything they believe in just because they are pissed that hilary didnt win. that goes to show that these people really don't care about issues at hand and this election is all about pride to them. this woman is also trying to get polar bears off the endangered species list, has $150 bounty on endangered wolves, and i would bet my left nut that if obama had a daughter old enough to get pregnant outside of marriage, the rhetoric from the republicans would consist of how family values don't matter to him. but i guess it all evens out since palin is pro-life. what a fucking joke. and people are falling for it. it disgusts me to no extent. i guess i need to start applying for a student/work visa for canada, huh?

[Penny Lane]

here's my take--it's rhetoric on both sides...so people are either stupid for wanting lower taxes, more drilling for oil, or trying to get abortion rights overturned, or people are stupid for wanting to socialize healthcare even further, not minding a much higher capital gains tax, and being nervous about an unexperienced candidate. what's an issue for you might not be an immediate issue for some other people--i don't understand how you can simplify either side as good or bad or stupid---so it's okay for women to flock to hilary for her stance on health care and her record in the senate (in a state where she had no affiliation before how many years ago?) but it's not okay for women to be drawn to palin for standing up to big oil companies and for being extremely pro life. both sides embellish all their attributes--i think it's a fascinating election--and in the end it comes down to how many states? ohio? PA? colorado or new mexico?  and look how many people came to ron paul's gathering up in MN--not even the libertarian candidate...i think more people are becoming vested in this election which is a good thing, too--(hopefully-guess we'll see at the polls)