The LOST thread

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

oh yeah, didn't the black smoke crash the plane? or did it just zoom in and make that engine explode? can't remember.

[mjkoehler]

Which plane, the original? No, that was from Desmond. I cannot remember the second plane's reason for going down. Yes, from that pic they are totally playing gin. You need to learn the rules to gin and gin rummy. 2 great ways to waste hours at a table. Adult beverages are totally required.

[el_chode]

Wow, I love the connections that weed helps the brain make. That's a lot of really interesting stuff. That card stuff is great and I hope it was intentional.

I'm gonna talk more broadly here, but as far as the alternative timeline, it seems to me that it looks like it's divided in halves: one half where the "fate" is the same and the means are different. Sun and Jin are still childless, but not by the same mechanism. In philosphese, it's consequentialist. The other side is deontologist - it is the rightness or wrongness of the acts that determine the outcome, not the outcome itself. This is shown best by Ben, who makes conscious decisions that aren't self serving.

As far as the physics go, I think they've mentioned the Casimir Effect before, which theoretically can be used to stabilize a wormhole. It basically says that in the quantum world, there is a negative force between two objects that will keep them from touching. I'm wondering if this show is an expansion of physical theories to metaphysical things or just people in general. For example, using your magnet example...there are some people that are always two north poles, ya know?

All in all, I think it will tie together numerous things in one big package - religion and science, physics and metaphysics, etc.

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

Which plane, the original? No, that was from Desmond. I cannot remember the second plane's reason for going down. Yes, from that pic they are totally playing gin. You need to learn the rules to gin and gin rummy. 2 great ways to waste hours at a table. Adult beverages are totally required.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV_WRk8PjeA[/media]

I'm talkin about this part.  you can see it schwoop in and hit the jet engine right before it sucks that dude in.  so my bad.

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

Wow, I love the connections that weed helps the brain make. That's a lot of really interesting stuff. That card stuff is great and I hope it was intentional.

I'm gonna talk more broadly here, but as far as the alternative timeline, it seems to me that it looks like it's divided in halves: one half where the "fate" is the same and the means are different. Sun and Jin are still childless, but not by the same mechanism. In philosphese, it's consequentialist. The other side is deontologist - it is the rightness or wrongness of the acts that determine the outcome, not the outcome itself. This is shown best by Ben, who makes conscious decisions that aren't self serving.

As far as the physics go, I think they've mentioned the Casimir Effect before, which theoretically can be used to stabilize a wormhole. It basically says that in the quantum world, there is a negative force between two objects that will keep them from touching. I'm wondering if this show is an expansion of physical theories to metaphysical things or just people in general. For example, using your magnet example...there are some people that are always two north poles, ya know?

All in all, I think it will tie together numerous things in one big package - religion and science, physics and metaphysics, etc.

yeah definitely.  that casimir theory stuff sounds awesome.  the "fate" stuff is interesting too.  the producers said the show explores "the human condition" so I assume it's both the science side and faith side merged into one coheisive system.  

yeah the pairs thing is interesting.

you've got:

jin/sun
desmond/penny
rose/bernard
kate/sawyer
widmore/eloise

...not sure.   I wish my lunch break was longer.

[the_wizzard]

Whatever Widmore has locked up on that sub is probably important as well.

My bet is Desmond is in that locked room......could be wrong, but I hope I am not!

I knew Des was way too important and had to come back to the island!  "See ya' in another life, brother"

[the_wizzard]

That card stuff is great and I hope it was intentional.

I agree...and I didn't notice it until Sticky pointed it out.  What does it mean?  Not sure, but it seems like an Easter Egg from the writers.  Regarding Jin: I think that the alt time line showing us Sun is still a Paik means that the Kwon on the wall is Jin.

As far as the physics go, I think they've mentioned the Casimir Effect before, which theoretically can be used to stabilize a wormhole. It basically says that in the quantum world, there is a negative force between two objects that will keep them from touching. I'm wondering if this show is an expansion of physical theories to metaphysical things or just people in general. For example, using your magnet example...there are some people that are always two north poles, ya know?

In the Lost world, could this possibly be applied to this idea:  Smokey is the negative force between 2 (or way more than 2) time lines/dimensions?  And allowing him to break into a time line/dimension by leaving the island would cause everything to "cease to exist" as Widmore told Jin?  It seems as though the 2 time lines we are watching these season are starting to bleed into one another (ie. Sun not being able to speak English).  Is this because Smokey is making some serious moves to get off the island?

And another thing I am trying to wrap my head around is that Zoe (who works for Widmore) is a geophysicist and is very curious about the pockets of electromagnetism (my sister has her PhD in GeoPhysics and researches volcanoes and subduction zones, so this interested me).  I have seen screen shots of OtherVille that show it clearly in the middle of a caldera or a crater.  Either way, that Island is a volcano.  With serious electromagnetic pockets of energy.  How do we pull this into the good/evil and fate/free will discussions?  And time travel?  I just get so confused when I try to pull all the mythology of Lost together in a neat little package  :o

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

That card stuff is great and I hope it was intentional.

I agree...and I didn't notice it until Sticky pointed it out.  What does it mean?  Not sure, but it seems like an Easter Egg from the writers.  Regarding Jin: I think that the alt time line showing us Sun is still a Paik means that the Kwon on the wall is Jin.

As far as the physics go, I think they've mentioned the Casimir Effect before, which theoretically can be used to stabilize a wormhole. It basically says that in the quantum world, there is a negative force between two objects that will keep them from touching. I'm wondering if this show is an expansion of physical theories to metaphysical things or just people in general. For example, using your magnet example...there are some people that are always two north poles, ya know?

In the Lost world, could this possibly be applied to this idea:  Smokey is the negative force between 2 (or way more than 2) time lines/dimensions?  And allowing him to break into a time line/dimension by leaving the island would cause everything to "cease to exist" as Widmore told Jin?  It seems as though the 2 time lines we are watching these season are starting to bleed into one another (ie. Sun not being able to speak English).  Is this because Smokey is making some serious moves to get off the island?

And another thing I am trying to wrap my head around is that Zoe (who works for Widmore) is a geophysicist and is very curious about the pockets of electromagnetism (my sister has her PhD in GeoPhysics and researches volcanoes and subduction zones, so this interested me).  I have seen screen shots of OtherVille that show it clearly in the middle of a caldera or a crater.  Either way, that Island is a volcano.  With serious electromagnetic pockets of energy.  How do we pull this into the good/evil and fate/free will discussions?  And time travel?  I just get so confused when I try to pull all the mythology of Lost together in a neat little package  :o

I think the religion parts of it play subtly.  The most obvious example of religion being used as a device to manipulate the characters is Richard ala MiB trying to convince him to kill the "devil" to escape "hell".  Perhaps it is hell for MiB and he does in fact represent Satan?

Jacob convinced Richard of the opposite that he was alive but could not absolve him of his sins so he chose to live forever in fear of death.  

I think Muslims believe that if you kill one person it's like killing the entire world. If you save someone's life it's like saving the entire world.  

MiB tried to use Yemie and Religion against Eko.  

I wonder if the interactions they have while dreaming are different than the waking visions.  I wonder if Jacob influences them in their dreams, telling Eko through his brother, that he needed to take over for locke.  He believed that shit but as soon as he was face to face to the smoke monster, bam! fuck you. dead.

Locke, when he tripped out and talked to Boone, Ghost Boone was all "oh right, you did it for the island.." and whatever.  Then he tells him he has to go save Eko before it's too late.  Why would he tell John to save him if he's just going to kill him as soon as he's saved.

John couldn't speak until he found Eko or something right?  Sorta similar to Sun.  the one thing they did for some reason was show Sun cut herself.  she had an open wound.  I wonder if MiB can fuck with them if he has access to their blood?  He told Jin to let his leg get some air?

Not sure what the deal with the cards are.  I think the episode in general was about subliminal messages and it may have just been for the episode since it was a Jin episode.  

Charlie went straight up evil there for a while in the beginning then after he got exiled he helped Eko build the church and became better.  It was kind of a lil Charlie Resurrection.  

The Baptism of Aaron.  When Locke was good he described it as a safety measure "just in case something happens he's protected" type thing.  

Jack's father's shoes, what up with those?  So Dead Locke had to be brought to the island wearing Dead Christians Shoes->Evil Locke puts on Christians shoes once he gets to dock on main island?

Like our minds are all connected man and like if MiB gets off the island like we all fade away like in back to the future?  Why does he click and take pictures when he's the smoke?  He can't fly over the water and can't pass through the soundwave beam thing.  Why? is it positive vibes?  

they're always like "fuck that dude/chicks dead we have to bury them!!"

The only people who see/communicate with the dead are Hurley and Miles?

Ben is a liar, Sun is a liar, Sawyer is a liar, Kate is a liar.
Sayid is claimed but he is bad ass, so bad ass that he realized he didn't feel his own emotions.  something tells me he's going to become good again or some shit.  But he can tell if you lie.

The Rules do not apply to Desmond.

Rules we know:

1.) Dead is Dead
2.) What happened, Happened
3.) You Can't Kill Yourself If _______
4.) Murder makes your soul "darker"
5.) On The Island You Get A Fresh Start
6.) ?

[el_chode]

I wonder if the smoke is the "force" repeling the timelines, then everyone is the anti-matter version of themselves, and if the anti- and posi- of matter meet, they annihilate

This is highly unlikely

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

I wonder if the smoke is the "force" repeling the timelines, then everyone is the anti-matter version of themselves, and if the anti- and posi- of matter meet, they annihilate

This is highly unlikely

Either way smokey is starting to get fucked with big time.  He's losing the little bit of control he thought he had I believe.  I'm fucking PUMPED for tonight, find out desmonds purpose hopefully.  

[mjkoehler]

H.O.L.Y. fuck. I think the walls just crumbled between both worlds.

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

H.O.L.Y. fuck. I think the walls just crumbled between both worlds.

Desmond is the bridge.

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

I think Sun is going to get healed by Juliet since Juliet was a baby master.   I'd love to get a peak than them teets once last time lost style.  If they ended the series with a 15-20minutes of the hot babes of the cast in a bikini dance party. That would be satisfying lost experience.  

This episode made me convinced even further the "universe"/exist/whatever is all our of consciousness.  If I was desmond I'd be using that xray machine like a drug.  "I need 12cc's of the past and/or future ASAP doctor".  fucking bad ass.

[el_chode]

My theory: Widmore knows how to control the island through time, and needs Desmond to be the pilot. He will send Desmond through time to stop the bomb from going off.

Reasons: Whenever the donkey wheel turned, an event similar to the hatch blowing up happened (purple sky, etc). That seems to correspond with a release of electromagnetic radiation. So if that can be harnessed, the island can be "steered". Desmond can probably slide through time without suffering the same side effects as everyone else if its physically traveling.

If it's the alternative theory, then Widmore is going to put Desmond in the radiation and try and steer his mind through time. The problem is you need to get Desmond's body back to 1977 or whenever.

Also, it remains unclear if Widmore knows the extent of what happens to Desmond when he slips through consciousnesses. I don't think he does.

And finally, did Desmond side with Locke implicitly since his alternative life sort of sucks? Or, does he still have a choice to make, a choice that is entangled between both worlds?

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

this is slightly off topic but it reminds me of lost sorta:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/04/100406172648.htm

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

My theory: Widmore knows how to control the island through time, and needs Desmond to be the pilot. He will send Desmond through time to stop the bomb from going off.

Reasons: Whenever the donkey wheel turned, an event similar to the hatch blowing up happened (purple sky, etc). That seems to correspond with a release of electromagnetic radiation. So if that can be harnessed, the island can be "steered". Desmond can probably slide through time without suffering the same side effects as everyone else if its physically traveling.

If it's the alternative theory, then Widmore is going to put Desmond in the radiation and try and steer his mind through time. The problem is you need to get Desmond's body back to 1977 or whenever.

Also, it remains unclear if Widmore knows the extent of what happens to Desmond when he slips through consciousnesses. I don't think he does.

And finally, did Desmond side with Locke implicitly since his alternative life sort of sucks? Or, does he still have a choice to make, a choice that is entangled between both worlds?

Desmond didn't side with anybody.  I think in order to give in to Locke you have to shake his hand, or grab his hand.  he's extended it to everyone so far.  Kate dissed him on it, Sun dissed him on it, Jin dissed him on it, Sawyer dissed him on it.  Plus, the rules don't apply and now Desmond on the island knows that it worked for sure and they changed the future.  Once Sawyer and those people find out, things will change somewhat.  

I'm glad faraday is alive and knows what's up since desmond was his constant or whatever.  

[el_chode]

My theory: Widmore knows how to control the island through time, and needs Desmond to be the pilot. He will send Desmond through time to stop the bomb from going off.

Reasons: Whenever the donkey wheel turned, an event similar to the hatch blowing up happened (purple sky, etc). That seems to correspond with a release of electromagnetic radiation. So if that can be harnessed, the island can be "steered". Desmond can probably slide through time without suffering the same side effects as everyone else if its physically traveling.

If it's the alternative theory, then Widmore is going to put Desmond in the radiation and try and steer his mind through time. The problem is you need to get Desmond's body back to 1977 or whenever.

Also, it remains unclear if Widmore knows the extent of what happens to Desmond when he slips through consciousnesses. I don't think he does.

And finally, did Desmond side with Locke implicitly since his alternative life sort of sucks? Or, does he still have a choice to make, a choice that is entangled between both worlds?

Desmond didn't side with anybody.  I think in order to give in to Locke you have to shake his hand, or grab his hand.  he's extended it to everyone so far.  Kate dissed him on it, Sun dissed him on it, Jin dissed him on it, Sawyer dissed him on it.  Plus, the rules don't apply and now Desmond on the island knows that it worked for sure and they changed the future.  Once Sawyer and those people find out, things will change somewhat.  

I'm glad faraday is alive and knows what's up since desmond was his constant or whatever.  

Penny is his new constant since when they touched he stopped being neurotic and the consciousnesses merged

And I don't nkow what it is about the Locke thing, but it's not in the touch. It's where your heart lies maybe.

[Sticky Icky Green Stuff]

I thought penny has always been desmonds constant? I need to gather my thoughts.

[the_wizzard]

H.O.L.Y. fuck. I think the walls just crumbled between both worlds.

Desmond is the bridge.

Nice...I like that metaphor!

[the_wizzard]

I thought penny has always been desmonds constant? I need to gather my thoughts.

Yes, she stopped him from coming down with the sickness on the freighter.  He is okay as long as he has Penny...