Overall theme of The Waterfall - Lost Love/Relationships?

[bloodthirsty]

I usually listen to the sonic nature of songs first and then dive into the lyrics and meaning of the song. That said this album is great and gets better with each listen. The overall tone I'm taking from this one is lost love.

If it's been discussed on here please let me know. Long time fan that finally got on this board. Thanks.

[Stevie]

Welcome!

I think that is certainly the case with a couple of the songs (Get the Point, Only Memories Remain) while others (Big Decisions, Thin Line) deal more with conflict that is present in the moment.  I hadn't really thought about it until just now but I think two themes that really tie the entire album together are change and optimism (sometimes in reference to the change).  Even the breakup songs portray the severed relationship in a proactive manner.  I said this in another thread but I think what we are seeing with Jim's music these days is someone willing himself into being an optimist.  He admitted as much in talking about how he wrote "Wonderful" at a low point in his life in an effort to turn things around. 

I remember an interview or whatever (around the time that Regions came out) in which he talked about (paraphrasing) wanting to make music that you come away from feeling happy.  I think the example he gave was how he would listen to Neil Young sometimes and although he really likes his music he would come away from it feeling kind of depressed...and he contrasted this with the feeling of listening to Kool and the Gang or Stevie Wonder and how great and uplifted that kind of music would make him feel.. so he set out to attempt the same kind of feeling. 

I also remember a remark he made recently (either in the Reddit AMA or in the listening party Q&A) about how he hates listening to his voice on older records and especially doesn't like how he sounded early on.  I could be making an assumption here but lots of his early stuff, although it had that glimmer of hope embedded in there, wasn't exactly uplifting and perhaps this is one thing that he doesn't like about it (perhaps this is also why some of those old, cherished white whales hardly ever surface). 

[bloodthirsty]

Thanks Stevie. I agree with the optimistic side of things especially on this record. A lot of the songs seem to deal with letting go and healing. Maybe that's just me reading into it what I want to read into it as I associate it with my own life experiences. I've been listening to this thing on repeat since Friday(yeah I grabbed the leak but also preordered the deluxe version) and it just keeps getting better with each listen.

I saw Jim at Forecastle a couple years ago and wow what an experience. Going to see MMJ for the first time this summer at Forecastle as well.

[SpaceWrangler]

I can't get past this nagging thought in the back of my head.  Listening to the lyrics of the songs - "Get The Point" and "Only Memories" being the most obvious - and some of the things Jim has said recently, I honestly believe the boys are done after the next album is released. 

Couple of things:

1. Break up songs on new album
2. Wanting to "stop the waterfall" meaning they want to stop time
3. Interview with Jim when he says that touring is brutal and his health issues
4. @OBH2 when they played Mahgeeta.  Instead of saying "Just listen, just slow down", Jim says "The end is near somehow"

Maybe I'm overthinking this.  Someone tell me I'm wrong!  Please. 

[itrainmonkeys]

I honestly believe the boys are done after the next album is released. 

I have heard that from people since Evil Urges.

[parkervb]

I can't get past this nagging thought in the back of my head.  Listening to the lyrics of the songs - "Get The Point" and "Only Memories" being the most obvious - and some of the things Jim has said recently, I honestly believe the boys are done after the next album is released. 

Couple of things:

1. Break up songs on new album
2. Wanting to "stop the waterfall" meaning they want to stop time
3. Interview with Jim when he says that touring is brutal and his health issues
4. @OBH2 when they played Mahgeeta.  Instead of saying "Just listen, just slow down", Jim says "The end is near somehow"

Maybe I'm overthinking this.  Someone tell me I'm wrong!  Please.

you're wrong - while I can't say that with 100% certainty, I just can't see them being "done".  These next two years are going to be big for them and it's quite possible there is a bit of hiatus after 2 album cycles in 2 years.  I do worry about Jim's back issues b/c those can bring lifelong difficulties.  I'd also be willing to bet the deal with Capitol Records is for more than 2 albums. 

[walterfredo]

regarding his back issues, I wonder if JJ would ever go the route of Mikey Houser (RIP) who spent the last many years of his career with Widespread Panic playing seated on stage due to health issues.  Mikey was never as active as JJ is on stage, so I don't think it really created a huge shift in the overall stage presence of WSP, which it would undoubtedly do to MMJ.  Just a thought. 

[justbcuzido]

regarding his back issues, I wonder if JJ would ever go the route of Mikey Houser (RIP) who spent the last many years of his career with Widespread Panic playing seated on stage due to health issues.  Mikey was never as active as JJ is on stage, so I don't think it really created a huge shift in the overall stage presence of WSP, which it would undoubtedly do to MMJ.  Just a thought.

I was thinking something similar. I mean Jim will have to tone down how physical he is on stage for the benefit of his health. However, I feel that will be really hard for him. I mean when you get on stage to play you just kind of forget what you're doing and go to outer space (and boy does Jim go to far galaxies) that by the time its all over you didn't even realize how hard you went.

I hope he doesn't ever have to go seated. But I'd rather see a seated Jim than no Jim..

But yeah they will not be "done" anytime soon. I mean Jim already says he has a solo album coming out next year with the next new album.

[walterfredo]

Nels Cline also comes to mind.  He suffers badly from back issues. 

[Santo]

I can't get past this nagging thought in the back of my head.  Listening to the lyrics of the songs - "Get The Point" and "Only Memories" being the most obvious - and some of the things Jim has said recently, I honestly believe the boys are done after the next album is released. 

Couple of things:

1. Break up songs on new album
2. Wanting to "stop the waterfall" meaning they want to stop time
3. Interview with Jim when he says that touring is brutal and his health issues
4. @OBH2 when they played Mahgeeta.  Instead of saying "Just listen, just slow down", Jim says "The end is near somehow"

Maybe I'm overthinking this.  Someone tell me I'm wrong!  Please.

you're wrong - while I can't say that with 100% certainty, I just can't see them being "done".  These next two years are going to be big for them and it's quite possible there is a bit of hiatus after 2 album cycles in 2 years.  I do worry about Jim's back issues b/c those can bring lifelong difficulties.  I'd also be willing to bet the deal with Capitol Records is for more than 2 albums.

I tend to agree with Parker. If you are reading into the negativity on this record, it has to do with then not now or the future. We're just seeing it now.  But I don't think that's the whole point. Others in this thread talked about the optimism on this record, classic Jim James splitting things into two parts. I see this record as beginning and end. Both good and bad. Also, I don't think we'll get the full theme of these songs until the second record and the solo album are released. Perhaps a Waterfall Trilogy?

[SpaceWrangler]

I can't get past this nagging thought in the back of my head.  Listening to the lyrics of the songs - "Get The Point" and "Only Memories" being the most obvious - and some of the things Jim has said recently, I honestly believe the boys are done after the next album is released. 

Couple of things:

1. Break up songs on new album
2. Wanting to "stop the waterfall" meaning they want to stop time
3. Interview with Jim when he says that touring is brutal and his health issues
4. @OBH2 when they played Mahgeeta.  Instead of saying "Just listen, just slow down", Jim says "The end is near somehow"

Maybe I'm overthinking this.  Someone tell me I'm wrong!  Please.

you're wrong - while I can't say that with 100% certainty, I just can't see them being "done".  These next two years are going to be big for them and it's quite possible there is a bit of hiatus after 2 album cycles in 2 years.  I do worry about Jim's back issues b/c those can bring lifelong difficulties.  I'd also be willing to bet the deal with Capitol Records is for more than 2 albums.

I tend to agree with Parker. If you are reading into the negativity on this record, it has to do with then not now or the future. We're just seeing it now.  But I don't think that's the whole point. Others in this thread talked about the optimism on this record, classic Jim James splitting things into two parts. I see this record as beginning and end. Both good and bad. Also, I don't think we'll get the full theme of these songs until the second record and the solo album are released. Perhaps a Waterfall Trilogy?

Really appreciate it yall!  I've been in a funk about this over the last two weeks (since I got the leak and OBH recordings - don't worry, I already bought the deluxe version twice, so I'm doing my part - and really dived into the lyrics).  I just needed to hear other educated opinions contrary to mine. 

[danimal]

I can't get past this nagging thought in the back of my head.  Listening to the lyrics of the songs - "Get The Point" and "Only Memories" being the most obvious - and some of the things Jim has said recently, I honestly believe the boys are done after the next album is released. 

Couple of things:

1. Break up songs on new album
2. Wanting to "stop the waterfall" meaning they want to stop time
3. Interview with Jim when he says that touring is brutal and his health issues
4. @OBH2 when they played Mahgeeta.  Instead of saying "Just listen, just slow down", Jim says "The end is near somehow"

Maybe I'm overthinking this.  Someone tell me I'm wrong!  Please.

Turn me on dead man...

[SpaceWrangler]

Turn me on dead man...

ha

number 9