Jim's change over the years

[jcc0065]

Let me get this straight. You think I'm being "waaaaay" too hostile, need to "chill out", and need to go easy in my replies to your post(s) because I am calling you out on your attacks on Jim where you are implying that he is an "Acid Head" or "A Burn-Out" or exactly as you stated it, "Yeah it just honestly seems like to me he's taken waaaaay too much acid. Not just cause he's getting old. He was tripping way too hard during that red rocks performance, it was obvious, and at times uncomfortable". You're saying this because you feel this to be true and because your friends agree...I'm I right about that, this is correct, and you're sticking with your story, am I right? Just 4 days ago in another thread that had almost 40 minutes of actual audio of Jim being interviewed by Hiss Golden Messenger's lead singer about the song writing process, you stated the following, "Sounds like ole Jimmy has been indulged (ing) in a little bit too much DOSE this tour". Where do you get off jumping to THAT conclusion!? In the 39 minute interview, drugs were NEVER mentioned. The only thing I can find that you may have latched onto is the quote of Jim saying something to the effect of him feeling that at times he receives messages or inspiration (bits of songs or melodies) from "The Universe" or "God" or "Whatever you want to call it", and he tries to remember to record them into his phone, so he won't forget them. What was that assumption all about, if it wasn't you saying Jim is a "Burn-Out/Acid-Head"? Them there's fightin' words, in my book!

Lastly, what was that "dig/jab" at me personally all about when you said, "For an old man you sure have "waaaay" too much hostility. chill out. just a topic on a forum"?

I feel that was a bit...odd on your part. Maybe if you had seen a photo of me or knew what I looked like, you might have added, "For an old fat man...". For someone who has only been a member of this here almighty Forum for a mere 27 days, you seem to be the one who is a bit too "hostile" and might need to "chill out"...or at least show some respect to your elders...Jim included.

im simply stating things that ive noticed....this is THAT serious to you isnt it? the fact of the matter is that jim has changed, especially this tour. if you dont see that youre just ignorant. that doesnt mean its a worse show or sounds worse. i listen to this band 24/7 and have nothing but amazing things to say, theres nothing wrong with me stating my opinions (that many people also agree with) is there? geez man, lay off the internet harrasment and enjoy the music. sending good vibes your way

[dontgetupset]

JCC0065, I assume you're a troll. I assume you're the type of troll that doesn't go around the internet finding random topics and goading people into discussions and I think you're a real MMJ fan but I think you wrote in a certain way in order to elicit a response.

If I'm wrong and you actually thought that something good would come about from writing in a juvenile fashion that could be because (and I really don't mean this as an insult) a lack of education or, perhaps (playing armchair psychologist for a moment) too many hallucinogens and/or opiates that had a numbing effect on what was once a vibrant and active brain that resulted in major projections on Jim.

I think its important to point out that I actually agree with your lack-of-energy assessment and feel that those who do not sense it are being overly optimistic. The problem here lies in

A) Your adolescence/immaturity in not even attempting to discuss this with Mr White civilly (I would call it an ad hominem attack but I feel that it was so unsophisticated that it shouldn't be described in terms that give it any sort of legitimacy).

B) Equally as important your pinpointing Jim's lack of energy on taking too much of a specific drug. One, I might add, that has very different effects on different people. A robust discussion could have ensued had you asked "I know Jim had that whole back pain thing but does anyone see tell-tale signs of drug use that might be contributing towards lesser energy? I have seen buddies that after years of heavy acid use that have a certain lethargy that I see in him. Maybe I'm crazy and its just the fact that he's approaching 40..."

I LOVE stories of rockers' drug use and though I don't think this forum is at all a good forum to attach a google footprint to a lurid tale I would love to hear stories of someone who has first-hand knowledge of any of the guys' current or past drug use. But I think its obvious that, to be blunt, you know absolutely nothing (in terms of first-hand knowledge) would be approaching would in defamation law would be deemed a "reckless disregard for the truth." (I'm aware that you're just conjecturing but with barely any evidence/proof/articulated rationale behind your assessment you come off as a fool. Not sayin' you ARE a fool but one loses legitimacy among this crowd when one acts like a child).

[Mr. White]

JCC0065, I assume you're a troll. I assume you're the type of troll that doesn't go around the internet finding random topics and goading people into discussions and I think you're a real MMJ fan but I think you wrote in a certain way in order to elicit a response.

If I'm wrong and you actually thought that something good would come about from writing in a juvenile fashion that could be because (and I really don't mean this as an insult) a lack of education or, perhaps (playing armchair psychologist for a moment) too many hallucinogens and/or opiates that had a numbing effect on what was once a vibrant and active brain that resulted in major projections on Jim.

I think its important to point out that I actually agree with your lack-of-energy assessment and feel that those who do not sense it are being overly optimistic. The problem here lies in

A) Your adolescence/immaturity in not even attempting to discuss this with Mr White civilly (I would call it an ad hominem attack but I feel that it was so unsophisticated that it shouldn't be described in terms that give it any sort of legitimacy).

B) Equally as important your pinpointing Jim's lack of energy on taking too much of a specific drug. One, I might add, that has very different effects on different people. A robust discussion could have ensued had you asked "I know Jim had that whole back pain thing but does anyone see tell-tale signs of drug use that might be contributing towards lesser energy? I have seen buddies that after years of heavy acid use that have a certain lethargy that I see in him. Maybe I'm crazy and its just the fact that he's approaching 40..."

I LOVE stories of rockers' drug use and though I don't think this forum is at all a good forum to attach a google footprint to a lurid tale I would love to hear stories of someone who has first-hand knowledge of any of the guys' current or past drug use. But I think its obvious that, to be blunt, you know absolutely nothing (in terms of first-hand knowledge) would be approaching would in defamation law would be deemed a "reckless disregard for the truth." (I'm aware that you're just conjecturing but with barely any evidence/proof/articulated rationale behind your assessment you come off as a fool. Not sayin' you ARE a fool but one loses legitimacy among this crowd when one acts like a child).

Thanks, dontgetupset. I thought I was all alone and was going crazy there for a moment. Good to see otherwise!

[jcc0065]

i just dont understand why there is argument over this topic!!! i didnt mean to offend anybody nor did i expect it to happen whatsoever. sorry, guys

[dontgetupset]

I actually have had the Hiss Golden Messenger interview open in my browser since JCC mentioned it because I thought that there would be some big REVEAL in which Jim, ya know, collapses or something mid-interview or speaks gibberish for 2 straight minutes. I'm glad to know that you invested the time and found nothing (the sound bytes you mentioned sound like very typical Jim-isms so much so that they move prove the point that his behavior/tone/style is pretty consistent).

Also even if someone could prove that his acid intake was up they would still have no idea how that links in to his (perceived) lack of energy. He's one of the busiest men in music and to burn out at some point is almost inevitable. Maybe he did already, maybe not, maybe he will need a psychological relaxation period for 2 years after the Beacon shows conclude. The most important thing is that very few people have insight into this and those that do are surely not discussing it in this venue. I'm just pretty amazed how reckless and shortsighted it was to make this 1:1 no-alternatives-are-possible causation.

[jcc0065]

JCC0065, I assume you're a troll. I assume you're the type of troll that doesn't go around the internet finding random topics and goading people into discussions and I think you're a real MMJ fan but I think you wrote in a certain way in order to elicit a response.

If I'm wrong and you actually thought that something good would come about from writing in a juvenile fashion that could be because (and I really don't mean this as an insult) a lack of education or, perhaps (playing armchair psychologist for a moment) too many hallucinogens and/or opiates that had a numbing effect on what was once a vibrant and active brain that resulted in major projections on Jim.

I think its important to point out that I actually agree with your lack-of-energy assessment and feel that those who do not sense it are being overly optimistic. The problem here lies in

A) Your adolescence/immaturity in not even attempting to discuss this with Mr White civilly (I would call it an ad hominem attack but I feel that it was so unsophisticated that it shouldn't be described in terms that give it any sort of legitimacy).

B) Equally as important your pinpointing Jim's lack of energy on taking too much of a specific drug. One, I might add, that has very different effects on different people. A robust discussion could have ensued had you asked "I know Jim had that whole back pain thing but does anyone see tell-tale signs of drug use that might be contributing towards lesser energy? I have seen buddies that after years of heavy acid use that have a certain lethargy that I see in him. Maybe I'm crazy and its just the fact that he's approaching 40..."

I LOVE stories of rockers' drug use and though I don't think this forum is at all a good forum to attach a google footprint to a lurid tale I would love to hear stories of someone who has first-hand knowledge of any of the guys' current or past drug use. But I think its obvious that, to be blunt, you know absolutely nothing (in terms of first-hand knowledge) would be approaching would in defamation law would be deemed a "reckless disregard for the truth." (I'm aware that you're just conjecturing but with barely any evidence/proof/articulated rationale behind your assessment you come off as a fool. Not sayin' you ARE a fool but one loses legitimacy among this crowd when one acts like a child).

Thanks, dontgetupset. I thought I was all alone and was going crazy there for a moment. Good to see otherwise!

i think i just misunderstood your response when i said "to each his own opinion!" trying to be nice and you just said "not really....."....it just sounded like you were attacking me. i apologize

[Rex]

Anyway, Jim doesn't even drink before a show and he certainly isn't tripping.

[justbcuzido]

Anyway, Jim doesn't even drink before a show and he certainly isn't tripping.

I agree, these guys are professionals... Now I will say OBH 2, Jim was drunk as hell, though that may have been due to Connor Oberst being there and them and Band of Horses partying together like old friends celebrating a reunion. But other than that, these guys take their stage craft and performances very seriously.

I remember reading or hearing in an interview they were saying while recording the waterfall they'd smoke a J and take walks along the beach, but that seems like a pretty normal thing to do.

My input on the matter is this, I think you are right in that Jim has changed a bit. He went through a seriously debilitating back injury (that will change anyone) and dealt with heart ache. In interviews recently, he does seem to be in a darker place and maybe even a bit jaded/burnt out. However, as far as him not moving around, I think he is being cautious as they have a very long tour.

I mean this is a guy who eats vegan for breakfast (I forget where the article is that shows his morning routine) and takes care of his body as much as he can. He is still recovering from an injury we don't know how serious it is. I don't think he'll ever go back to how he was in his 20's and that's ok. What I have noticed is that during shows he tends to loosen up a lot.

Most importantly, he is playing and singing better than he has in years and that goes for the rest of the band. They are on fire right now. So if that means they have to "sacrifice" bouncing around on stage, I am ok with that.

[WinstonLegthigh]

I got to 6 shows (Red Rocks included) over the summer, and while the lack of mobility was noticeable (even in comparison to the last tour and solo tour), I'm going to assume it has to do with the back issues that were mentioned.

[jcc0065]

Anyway, Jim doesn't even drink before a show and he certainly isn't tripping.

I agree, these guys are professionals... Now I will say OBH 2, Jim was drunk as hell, though that may have been due to Connor Oberst being there and them and Band of Horses partying together like old friends celebrating a reunion. But other than that, these guys take their stage craft and performances very seriously.

I remember reading or hearing in an interview they were saying while recording the waterfall they'd smoke a J and take walks along the beach, but that seems like a pretty normal thing to do.

My input on the matter is this, I think you are right in that Jim has changed a bit. He went through a seriously debilitating back injury (that will change anyone) and dealt with heart ache. In interviews recently, he does seem to be in a darker place and maybe even a bit jaded/burnt out. However, as far as him not moving around, I think he is being cautious as they have a very long tour.

I mean this is a guy who eats vegan for breakfast (I forget where the article is that shows his morning routine) and takes care of his body as much as he can. He is still recovering from an injury we don't know how serious it is. I don't think he'll ever go back to how he was in his 20's and that's ok. What I have noticed is that during shows he tends to loosen up a lot.

Most importantly, he is playing and singing better than he has in years and that goes for the rest of the band. They are on fire right now. So if that means they have to "sacrifice" bouncing around on stage, I am ok with that.

very well said!

[millerjustin]

safe to say that everything is back to OK in the sandbox, people?

Based on everything said above and my own observations, I agree that Jim is sticking closer to his padded square on the stage - and for very good reason.  He had back surgery a year ago and it still hurts!  I'm speaking from experience with back pain and also from first-hand experience watching him this year (OBH2, Waterfall in L'ville, Boston, Forecastle, Artpark and Red Rocks).

I have my own theories about the new jacket (flowing to hide the brace under his vest) and the glasses (he's laser focused on new lyrics and arrangements).  He's a fucking professional, people. 

And not for nothing, I was front row under Jim at OBH, Headliners and Red Rocks and he not only smiled a ton at his band mates, he also threw a few my way while he was playing.  (this may be partly because I was rocking out with Erica Moore, but that's another story for another day).

and the biggest point I'd like to make - and hopefully without insulting our new friend - is that Red Rocks was a Coda moment for the band and they knew it.  They had the most preeminent concert photographer in the world in Danny Clinch capturing every sound and move - with the backdrop of the show becoming the next Okonokos (and timestamp for Jacket 3.0).  This being said, Jim was obviously not tripping balls - just a tight back and biggest show of the year.

Move on people!  I GET 11 MORE SHOWS IN THE NEXT 9 WEEKS!!!!

[jcc0065]

safe to say that everything is back to OK in the sandbox, people?

Based on everything said above and my own observations, I agree that Jim is sticking closer to his padded square on the stage - and for very good reason.  He had back surgery a year ago and it still hurts!  I'm speaking from experience with back pain and also from first-hand experience watching him this year (OBH2, Waterfall in L'ville, Boston, Forecastle, Artpark and Red Rocks).

I have my own theories about the new jacket (flowing to hide the brace under his vest) and the glasses (he's laser focused on new lyrics and arrangements).  He's a fucking professional, people. 

And not for nothing, I was front row under Jim at OBH, Headliners and Red Rocks and he not only smiled a ton at his band mates, he also threw a few my way while he was playing.  (this may be partly because I was rocking out with Erica Moore, but that's another story for another day).

and the biggest point I'd like to make - and hopefully without insulting our new friend - is that Red Rocks was a Coda moment for the band and they knew it.  They had the most preeminent concert photographer in the world in Danny Clinch capturing every sound and move - with the backdrop of the show becoming the next Okonokos (and timestamp for Jacket 3.0).  This being said, Jim was obviously not tripping balls - just a tight back and biggest show of the year.

Move on people!  I GET 11 MORE SHOWS IN THE NEXT 9 WEEKS!!!!

I met Erica through twitter and in person in Atlanta! really awesome and genuine person

[Taterbug]

safe to say that everything is back to OK in the sandbox, people?

You'll  never get all the cat poop out of the sandbox :)

[Mr. White]

safe to say that everything is back to OK in the sandbox, people?

You'll  never get all the cat poop out of the sandbox :)

...but we're getting there...

[APR]

I've been up close a few times over the summer and never noticed a back brace.  I did notice Jim's eyes were open more than in past tours.  So I thought the sunglasses were more to hide his open eyes so that he can freely look around the venue or the fans without people knowing he is looking at them.

I feel also that besides nixing his jumping on and off of the drum riser, Jim has been moving quite a bit especially when without a guitar in hand.

[PJAMVedder]

Even hinting that he's tripping too hard on acid is the stupidest thing I've ever read.

[Lonndown27]

holy shit what a thread hahahah Mr. White you're an AWESOME old man  and dontgetupset, that was a fucking perfect rebuttal.

I wonder how, JCC, you'd feel if we were all speculating about your drug use. That the whole topic was written while you were engaging in your nightly heroin rituals where you listen to only 20 songs, not 30 anymore, because YOU'VE changed man, you're NOT the same! You're absolutely on smack because of the sun glasses, bro 

Jim and Bo ARE TOOOOOTALLY SHOOTING UP JUNKIES! I've seen Jim's ass cheek before and I saw the track marks...Seriously Braaaaa      

[Lonndown27]

And insulting people who happen to be some of my favorite people (Mr. White) on this forum or anywhere in humanity, and trying to do it with internet-idiot-savant-"subtlety" by saying "old man"? Like what?

JCC welcome aboard but Jesus man, this band probably does or did drugs but fuck...they're not in their 20s. Jim has a right to be more than angry about how the industry has changed and how self sufficient they have to be financially and how much their bodies have to be on that line to tour, to feed their families first of all, let alone feed their tour crew's families and them...like MMJ are getting bigger by the day and I've been absolutely god-fucked to have watched their evolution from since I first got into them in April 2004 to now and see what heights they've been to....I mean even the major ones off of my head are astounding: Red Rocks 2012, Red Rocks 2015, KFC 2010, Terminal 5 2010, the costume intro to Voodoo 2010, Bonnaroo 2008, Bonnaroo 2006, 2006 NYE @ Fillmore (THANK YOU JOHNNYYAC!!!), NYE 2008, UNSTAGED 2011, OKONOKOS @ Fillmore 2005, Lebowski Fest 2004....maybe they were on drugs, probably, maybe they werent all the time, maybe they were just high some of the time. Maybe Patrick and Bo snort coke onstage in their towels like Aerosmith? Maybe Jim James smoked a bong on a camel once? Maybe he took SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much acid he told the audience to "feel the love" and how he would "say a prayer to the universe"?

What a crazy bunch of drug fiends!!! These MMJ bastards! I'm calling Narcotics Anonymous!   







hopefully my satire isnt lost on anyone 

WELCOME TO THE MOTHERFUCKIN SANDBOX JCC! 

[walterfredo]

I thought sticky was banned?

[davymac]

Should have popped some popcorn before reading this thread!