My take on the "leak"

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

Okay, I'm reversing myself and posting a short rant on why I think it's wrong to gobble up the new record because it's "leaked".

We are talking about My Morning Jacket, and for that reason I decline to accept "it's already happening" or "that's the way of the music biz these days" or some other kow-towing excuse to steal this record.  There, I said it.  The fans who post here about the "leak" I am hoping will actually buy the record when it does come out to support their favorite band.

It's the unseen masses of folks who won't buy the record and support the band I am most concerned with, and this "leak" feeds that like a gasoline fire.  How many  downloads from Kaaza will it take to cut into the sales of the record?  

MMJ is a special convergence of music and love and community.  This "leak" denigrates them to a mere commodity to be consumed, IMHO...like a Mocha Frappacino, or a pack of Depends, or some other hopeless tripe.  The record comes out tentatively in September.  Some of us view that as special and worthy of savoring and waiting for.  For those of you who just can't wait for your instant gratification, so be it.

[McGuire]

Yeah, we have ourselves a leak! Maybe you're overreacting. This happens with every highly anticipated album and will not hurt any future sales because MP3's sound like shit! Anyone in a right state of mind and enough love for the music will end up buying the real thing. Leak or no leak. By the way, this must be the smallest leak ever because I don't see shit in the usual places! I download albums all the time, just to see if I like it or not and when I do, I go out and buy the real thing. My Morning Jacket has nothing to worry about. I would never have discovered this band if I had not downloaded their stuff. Now I own all their albums, the real thing, and saw a shitload of shows.

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

Yeah, we have ourselves a leak! Maybe you're overreacting. This happens with every highly anticipated album and will not hurt any future sales because MP3's sound like shit! Anyone in a right state of mind and enough love for the music will end up buying the real thing. Leak or no leak. By the way, this must be the smallest leak ever because I don't see shit in the usual places! I download albums all the time, just to see if I like it or not and when I do, I go out and buy the real thing. My Morning Jacket has nothing to worry about. I would never have discovered this band if I had not downloaded their stuff. Now I own all their albums, the real thing, and saw a shitload of shows.

see, that's a middle ground I can accept.

But the uneducated who just rip it off who I really worry about.  Obviously you are not of that ilk...

[EC]

see, that's a middle ground I can accept.

But the uneducated who just rip it off who I really worry about.  Obviously you are not of that ilk...

Props to you John for posting your opinion.  I think it's actually a good, interesting discussion.  This whole thing has made me rethink a few things and get a better understanding on where I stand.  :)

[aMillionDreams]

what about the fan who would never hear mmj if it weren't for free mp3s?  And then that fan may go see them in concert, which puts more money into the pocket of the band.  Record companies get ripped off the music is leaked.  Or maybe Im just rationalizing because I really want to hear the new album.
BTW, will someone kindly send me the link?  (I promise to buy the albuum anyway when it comes out anyway :)+

[EC]

what about the fan who would never hear mmj if it weren't for free mp3s?  And then that fan may go see them in concert, which puts more money into the pocket of the band.  Record companies get ripped off the music is leaked.  Or maybe Im just rationalizing because I really want to hear the new album.
BTW, will someone kindly send me the link?  (I promise to buy the albuum anyway when it comes out anyway :)+

But again, what about the artfulness of the final product, and the fact that anything we create, we hope it's experienced in the proper environment, ie, NOT a cruddy mp3, and NOT without the liner notes and artwork?  

And we don't want record companies to lose money, really, either, because if they go under, well... we're fucked.

It's all about respect.  Respect for someone's efforts, respect for their wishes.  

Again, for me, for me, for me.  Only my opinion.

[aMillionDreams]

How are we fucked if the record companies go under?  As a musician you show know that taking music out of the hands of the record companies is a good thing for musicians.  I agree with you about the mp3 sound quality stuff and that's why I'll buy a copy of CD when it comes out and I'll buy the vinyl as well because I'm a collector of sorts.  But I also really want to hear the new tunes.  Don't kid yourself about taking food off of the band's dinner table, though.  The way to show the band respect is to go to the shows and spread the word.  I agree with you about the artfulness of a creation, but at this point I am like a smack addict, I just want a little taste.

[JacketGal]

This is an interesting argument for sure. I agree with a lot of the points that many of you have made, and I do think that there will be some greedy souls out there who will not buy the record because they downloaded it. But I believe the bigger number will be the ones who will download and buy it. I think we do this because we want to feel like we own something, it's not just a CD-R with some music on it! We want a case, we want to read lyrics, see the artwork and smell the smell of a new CD! (Maybe I'm off my rocker, but music fans will always want the record, even if they get the leaked copy)

An interesting thing to consider is the tale of Yankee Hotel Foxtrot. I remember seeing Wilco 4th of July in Chicago before they could find a record company to distribute the new record, all the fans new all the lyrics to all the words because Wilco actually put it up themselves on their site for download by anyone, anytime. Tweedy commented, "You guys know all the lyrics...now HOW did that happen?" (wink~wink)

After they found a record label who would distribute it, Yankee Hotel Foxtrot became their best-selling record to date. (I think that AGIB actually eclipsed that now...but that's antother thread ;))

I'm going out on a limb but it might actually help their overall sales, once ppl hear them...they'll be hooked and want to get more of their music...?

[utonynashm]

LEAKED?  Wow....So I guess it's done then...I thought the delay was to work on the record...

Wait, how are people even hearing the album?

[aMillionDreams]

it's on the internet, somewhere, which reminds me...

WILL SOMEONE PLEASE SEND ME THE LINK!?!?!?!?!

[utonynashm]

No man...just wait for it...

[EC]

How are we fucked if the record companies go under?  As a musician you show know that taking music out of the hands of the record companies is a good thing for musicians.  I agree with you about the mp3 sound quality stuff and that's why I'll buy a copy of CD when it comes out and I'll buy the vinyl as well because I'm a collector of sorts.  But I also really want to hear the new tunes.  Don't kid yourself about taking food off of the band's dinner table, though.  The way to show the band respect is to go to the shows and spread the word.  I agree with you about the artfulness of a creation, but at this point I am like a smack addict, I just want a little taste.

Dude, if record companies go under, how are records going to be made?  

This has NOTHING to do with taking anybody's dinner away.

I understand the "crack addict" part, too.  But there's loads of condoned, live versions of some of these songs floating around.


And JacketGirl, the difference (presumably) with Wilco, is that Wilco did that themselves.

Anyhow.  I don't know, everybody make the choice that they can live with.  :)

[SMc55]

McGuire and amilliondreams are right, I think. Downloading freebies does seem to be the way people hear new stuff now. I would hate to think it affects the band's income, but think most people who find they are interested buy the albums. And those who don't wouldn't have bought them anyway.  

I also think the album notes and pictures are hugely important, although I never read them until I've been listening to the music for a while. They mean more to me then, somehow.

I think it was sweatboard who pointed out that it's a long time to wait. We all know the album is finished and the release has already been put back. People who've been to the shows have been talking about the new songs already, and for me it just heightens the anticipation. I don't have the dilemma that some of you have as I don't have the wherewithall to download anyway. I'll wait for the album, fall in love with it and then read the cover notes a week or so later.

[Danko71]

Okay, forget the ethical commentary for a minute...for those who've heard it, what do you think? Or should I even ask? I'm sure it'll get glowing reviews for most of y'all but any specific feedback or insight would be appreciated. I read the Billboard review and I'm expecting a departure of sorts which could lead to a moderate critical smackdown, but who knows.
p.s. For the record, I've never downloaded anything. I don't even know how.

[aMillionDreams]

Dude, if record companies go under, how are records going to be made?  

Without record companies, records would get made by musicians.  With modern technologies, anyone has the ability to record, produce, and distribute an album via the internet, photoshop, and Protools.  The only reason for a record company is to leech off of someone else's creation.  I don't know how things have gone in Canada, but in America record companies have been ripping of musicians, promoting no-talent hacks, and ignoring talent musicians who don't interest them for the past seventy years.  If record complanies went away, music would still be produced and it would be more honest and less commercial and everyone could eat at the table.

[aMillionDreams]

Danko71, I think you're looking for the thread marked *Spoiler

[Danko71]

Whoops, got it. Thanks...

[biscuitbobo]

.....yeah, so where's this leak?  what's the difference if some lug head downloads it in late october??????  Personally, my wife and I work 6 days a week in a music store, sell as much MMJ as possible, see their shows repeatedly, buy the t-shirts (except the one tommy gave me) and do whatever we can to expose mmj......trying to rationalize if it's okay to hear their new album before it's out seems an irrelevant and a non-conclusive argument...the people that don't buy it, won't buy it ANYWAY, and do we really need them around?  If MMJ means so little to them to steal their music and relagate themselves to shithead casual fan status who's only happy with a burned copy, then let them stay home when we're out HAPPILY seeing our favorite band for $20 (or whatever they ask us to pay), cause personally I'd rather just be around the real fans anway...so peoples, get off the high self righteous horses and throw me and amilliondreams a bone...so where's this link to "Z"????

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

I'm not on any high horses.  I simply regard their music as something special, something more like art than the latest Jessica Simpson.  And I respect your efforts on their behalf (I too have done a little promotion for them  ;)).

Thing is, if it's "leaked", that means someone along the way that was trusted with the tracks broke that trust.  The music didn't just ooze out of the walls and crawl thru the streets, now did it?

And I'm not discounting that people discovered the band thru MP3's.  Of course that's a good thing...AFTER the record is offically released.

[biscuitbobo]

if it's not a "consumable commodity" (which almost makes you want to throw in "commerce",too)  why isn't everything just free then?  No, of course, it's not Jessica Simpson, that's absurd..it is art, and i do want them to make a living playing, and i do want to hear "Z" the album!!!!!!!!