Alien Interview???

[EC]

I also suggest reading Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, a fine book and good read that makes philosophical points without being preachy.  It will also convince you not to look too deeply into these issues...go rent Pi if you really want to get freaked.

mwahahahaa

That is really really weird that you just said that, John.  

And funny that it's in this thread.  Coincidences, serendipity, all that jazz is so high these days.  For me.  :)

I hear you Tony.  I remember one night not being able to sleep because I was forcing myself to be able to deal with the concept of infinity.  And the concept of time not existing, that things neither started nor will end.

Onward with your questing and questioning, then.   :)

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

That is really really weird that you just said that, John.  

And funny that it's in this thread.  Coincidences, serendipity, all that jazz is so high these days.  For me.  :)

I hear you Tony.  I remember one night not being able to sleep because I was forcing myself to be able to deal with the concept of infinity.  And the concept of time not existing, that things neither started nor will end.

Onward with your questing and questioning, then.   :)

aha, Zen deals with the author's struggle with the meaning of the word quality.  Groove on that for awhile...what DOES the word quality mean?  

[EC]

Yeah.

Man, the quality section just got my brain going for weeks.  Has anybody read his other book, I think it's called Lily?

[utonynashm]

I just rented Pi and Waking Life....Just watched Pi, and that was one of the coolest flicks EVER....

Putting on Waking Life now...

[CC]

I just rented Pi and Waking Life....Just watched Pi, and that was one of the coolest flicks EVER....

Putting on Waking Life now...

Pi is awesome.
I just know you're gonna love Waking Life too.
good choices.

[CC]

ps. ever thought of the fact that we might be looking for aliens too far away? what beings are looking the most out of place on this planet? right, human beings. maybe WE are the aliens. i'm feeling philosophical today...

[utonynashm]

I know...exactly...

[EC]

But we are aliens to what we call aliens.

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

But we are aliens to what we call aliens.

this is awesome.  yes, aren't we aliens to everything?  if you dig deep enough (and have a big enough ego), isn't EVERYTHING alien to YOU?  we can't know what it's like to BE someone else, so all we know is what we know...how does the song go-"all you touch and all you see, is all your life will ever be?"  

i'd sure love to be someone else (for a little while) just to see what they see, feel what they feel.  true empathy really doesn't exist.

[EC]

Interesting, interesting.

i'd sure love to be someone else (for a little while) just to see what they see, feel what they feel.  true empathy really doesn't exist.

Perhaps pure empathy doesn't exist, but I think that empathy in the sense of how we mean it does.  

Warning: what some people refer to as "flakiness" will ensue:

I've had relationships with people where it's pretty freaky.  Like, in the middle of the day, for no reason, (ie everything's totally fine), I'll get a horrible feeling of sadness or something, and later on speak to the person, and someone really bad happened to them around the same time.  And it makes sense to me (in my head) that if you're really close with someone, and spending a lot of time with them, that you're bound to have a connection that is outside the regular realm of those kinds of things.  

There's a weird thing that happens with girls, for example (quit reading now if things of the female nature freak you out), where if you're living with another female, your cycles will eventually work themselves out to be the same.  What the hell is that?  It happens ALL the time, too.  Do guys know about that?  I mean, actually, it's fairly convenient aside from the insane dual bitchiness that happens for a few days.  ;)

But that's not really what you're talking about, John.  heh.

Have you seeing Being John Malkovich?

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

oh yeah, saw that many times.  :)

i guess it begs the question:  do we have empathy for others to benefit ourselves, or is there truly "a selfless act"?  not sure anymore.

and as for the cycling:  I've worked in offices with 15 women and 2 men.  I know all too well about the cycling together, and I don't mean wearing peddle pushers and ringing any bells!  That's a pheromone thing, I think.  

[EC]

i guess it begs the question:  do we have empathy for others to benefit ourselves, or is there truly "a selfless act"?  not sure anymore.

Well, I think it all works together... in the end, it's kind of like, everybody wins, right?  I don't have a problem with empathetic, or kind, or whatever, acts benefitting the person who is the helper.  I'm not a big fan of martyrs, though.  And a selfless act in a way, I think, can't exist. But maybe that's okay...  It's much better if all parties involved benefit from the action.  

That's a pheromone thing, I think.

Really?!  Woah.  See, that's really interesting.  Everybody walking around, mixing it up, getting all of our chemicals and biomatter and chemical reactions into each other via noses and the like, sharing energy fields...  Rather mind-fucking.

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

Well, I think it all works together.    So in the end, it's kind of like, everybody wins, right?  I don't have a problem with empathetic, or kind, or whatever, acts benefitting the person who is the helper.  I'm not a big fan of martyrs, though.  And a selfless act in a way, I think, can't exist.  But maybe that's okay...  If I'm not being clear enough, I can explain what I mean further.  

Really?!  Woah.  See, that's really interesting.  Everybody walking around, mixing it up, getting all of our chemicals and biomatter and chemical reactions into each other via noses and the like, sharing energy fields...  Rather mind-fucking.

yes, yes it is!  rather amazing to think chemicals we can't see or smell are influencing others around us...makes ya think, eh?

[EC]

heh, you quoted before I modified.  :)

See I've been really interested in the whole idea of attraction being somewhat chemical.  Chemical, emotional, all kinds of things.  We all know what it's like when you meet somebody and you click right away, right?  (Not just in the romantic world, but also just in the friendship world.)  There are people who you instantly like, but can't necessarily figure out why.

And then there are people you meet who you should totally be into (this is, more specifically, in the romantic world), but you're not.  They're attractive, you jive on similar things, etc. but it's just not working for you.

I find it all very interesting.

But I try to stop myself thinking about it all too much, because I don't find that it actually helps, and in some ways, it completely ignores the magical element of all of this, which you can't really explain anyhow.

[peanut butter puddin surprise]

heh, you quoted before I modified.  :)

See I've been really interested in the whole idea of attraction being somewhat chemical.  Chemical, emotional, all kinds of things.  We all know what it's like when you meet somebody and you click right away, right?  (Not just in the romantic world, but also just in the friendship world.)  There are people who you instantly like, but can't necessarily figure out why.

And then there are people you meet who you should totally be into (this is, more specifically, in the romantic world), but you're not.  They're attractive, you jive on similar things, etc. but it's just not working for you.

I find it all very interesting.

But I try to stop myself thinking about it all too much, because I don't find that it actually helps, and in some ways, it completely ignores the magical element of all of this, which you can't really explain anyhow.

 ;D

all righty then!

[tomEisenbraun]

Hehe, leave for a couple days and look what happens. I'm not gonna get in any arguments with this one, but I have to say somehting about the "magic" Meg referred to. I think a lot of what our lives are missing today is the "mystery" of it all. We teach kids about sex in kindergarten so that they don't have to face it "unprepared" like a kindergartner would be thinking about it if they weren't. Most kids that age are still under the Cootie Law. I think it's our cultural mystery killing that is sucking a lot of the life out our country's minds these days. By trying to concieve an answer for everything, i think it takes a bit of the fun of all the mystery away. I mean, wouldn't "War of the Worlds" kick so much more ass if we had absolutely no idea what was on Mars?

[EC]

Eisey, are you saying that the unknown is better than the known?

We teach kids about sex in kindergarten so that they don't have to face it "unprepared"

I learned about sex in kindgergarten, and I don't think that it's ever destroyed any kind of magic about it.  

I mean, of COURSE, mystery is fun, but I think things can be magical even in the realm of knowledge.  Maybe even moreso, because the magical things, the weird things, seem that much more wicked...  As opposed to all of us walking around going "Why am I not flying into the sky?  It must be magic."

And, woah I know where this is going, but isn't God kind of an "answer" to the really big mystery?

Really, really, really not trying to be offensive.  I know your status on this subject, and I think you know mine.  It just seems like an easy way out to address all of the mysteries of the world with a great big mystery (ie God).

Again, you know I really like you, and I think you're awesome, so I'm not trying to offend your belief system.  

[tomEisenbraun]

Well, I'm not arguing for ignorance, but I think there is a subtle goodness in not knowing too much. Like, when there's still things that make you blush. I guess I'm taking more just against sex ed right here, and not so much other stuff, but I think some of the greatest fiction came more out of wonder than knowledge. Like Ray Bradbury's "Martian Chronicles", where the author is living in a world in which we haven't even put a man in space and he's dreamed up a way, not only to get to Mars, but how to live there, and what kind of beings would reside ont he planet. Not to say that actually putting a man on Mars would be bad, scientifically, but I think it's very cool how there's things we don't, and can't know. I think there's a lot of beauty in mystery.

And Meg, is the "really big mystery" you're talking about the "why are we here?" question? Because then, yes, God is the answer to it. I believe He put each and every one of us here for a reason, and that there is nothing that happens without reason.

My friends and I were talking about aliens on our camping trip this weekend and someone suggested this (keep in mind that we are all Christian, so I'm not typing this as an "I'm right, your wrong" deal, but merely as speculation, because I dont think any of us know for real about extra-terrestrials):
 maybe we are truly the only planet that has life on it, because surely God would have revealed it to us by now if we weren't through actual feasible contact and interaction with another planet. But what if there were "aliens" but what people thoght were aliens were really just demons and spirits trying to cause doubt and disbelief in God. BEcause if that's what they were, then they'd be doing a pretty darn good job. Because all of the speculation about life out there somewhere can really draw you out of your shell and put you in a position where you don't have either evidence or a solid opinion and can really cause doubt.

One way to look at it, i suppose. Not sayign that that isn't a bit supernatural in itself, but it gives a very good logic on the nature and purpose of e.t.'s if you believe in Christianity. Not saying i would quit believing if earth was attacked, but probably doubt very seriously if i were abducted or whatever.

Thanks, Megan, for respecting my beliefs and whatnot. Sorry for the long paragraphs. What's your stance on all of this?

[EC]

And Meg, is the "really big mystery" you're talking about the "why are we here?" question? Because then, yes, God is the answer to it. I believe He put each and every one of us here for a reason, and that there is nothing that happens without reason.

That was kind of what I meant, but more of the "where did we come from", becuase I don't know if I actually believe there's a reason per se as to why we're here...  I do believe in serendipity and synchronicity, though.  And I'm feeling a little more committed to that these days (ie I'll say I actually believe that, as opposed to hinting at the maybe of it and just sitting on the fence, which I can tend to do.)

Because all of the speculation about life out there somewhere can really draw you out of your shell and put you in a position where you don't have either evidence or a solid opinion and can really cause doubt.

But aren't there a lot of things in this world - things that we can actually see and feel - cause for questioning of your belief system?  I have a really good friend who is a solid Catholic.  She is very passionate about her religion, but she also questions everything about it.  Constantly.  And when she has really hard questions, she goes to people to ask them about it.  And they talk, and what it does, she says for her, is solidify her faith even further.  One of the deals about religion (or specifically Christianity in all of its forms) that really upsets me is that you're not supposed to question things, you're supposed to take things at face value, from a book that you've read, or from a man who tells you certain things on a Sunday morning.  I understand that it's been set up to work that way, but I know for me, the only way I ever get feeling okay with something is if I question it, and really try to understand how I feel about it.

What's your stance on all of this?

I don't know.  I think it's pretty weird that there have been so many conspiracy theories, and so many "sightings", and knowing how the world/government works, it wouldn't surprise me that they're covering up a hell of a lot.  I don't believe I've ever seen a UFO, or encountered an alien, or been a receptor to some other planet's messages.  I think there's a possibility for it, if it happened here, it's probably happened elsewhere (life, I mean).  But I don't think about it too much, I don't think...  It doesn't really concern me one way or the other.

However, after having watched 2001:A Space Odyssey for the first time yesterday (I know, I know, it was a long time coming), I'm kind of re-interested in space travel.  I used to have dreams all the time where I travelled to the moon or other planets and checked them out.

Here's what I'm ripping out in my head right now:  Is existence life?  What is life and what is existence.  I mean, I kind of know, but for humans, life is existence.  For a rock, we assume, existence is not life (it's not living).

...or is it? ;)

Thanks, Megan, for respecting my beliefs and whatnot.

And thank you, Tom, for respecting mine, and for taking my word for it that I wasn't trying to offend you.  :)

[tomEisenbraun]

One thing I'd like to say about the questioning business. It's not forbidden. Maybe in some more uptight circles, it is. But probably the biggest thing thats helped me grow in faith were questions. Stuff that didn't make sense and being able to talk to my stepdad and start seeing answers to these questions revealed. I'm a huge believer in the fact that there's an answer for just about everything in religion waiting for you if you take the time and effort to listen for it.