the books we read

[Jenny]

how bout poems?

I am absolutely IN LOVE with "The Love Song of Alfred J. Prufrock".
Perhaps a little depressing.  But every time I read it, I love it a little bit more.


     S'io credesse che mia risposta fosse
     A persona che mai tornasse al mondo,
     Questa fiamma staria senza piu scosse.
     Ma perciocche giammai di questo fondo
     Non torno vivo alcun, s'i'odo il vero,
     Senza tema d'infamia ti rispondo.


LET us go then, you and I,      
When the evening is spread out against the sky      
Like a patient etherised upon a table;      
Let us go, through certain half-deserted streets,      
The muttering retreats              5
Of restless nights in one-night cheap hotels      
And sawdust restaurants with oyster-shells:      
Streets that follow like a tedious argument      
Of insidious intent      
To lead you to an overwhelming question ...              10
Oh, do not ask, "What is it?"      
Let us go and make our visit.      

In the room the women come and go      
Talking of Michelangelo.      

The yellow fog that rubs its back upon the window-panes,              15
The yellow smoke that rubs its muzzle on the window-panes      
Licked its tongue into the corners of the evening,      
Lingered upon the pools that stand in drains,      
Let fall upon its back the soot that falls from chimneys,      
Slipped by the terrace, made a sudden leap,              20
And seeing that it was a soft October night,      
Curled once about the house, and fell asleep.      

And indeed there will be time      
For the yellow smoke that slides along the street,      
Rubbing its back upon the window-panes;              25
There will be time, there will be time      
To prepare a face to meet the faces that you meet;      
There will be time to murder and create,      
And time for all the works and days of hands      
That lift and drop a question on your plate;              30
Time for you and time for me,      
And time yet for a hundred indecisions,      
And for a hundred visions and revisions,      
Before the taking of a toast and tea.      

In the room the women come and go              35
Talking of Michelangelo.      

And indeed there will be time      
To wonder, "Do I dare?" and, "Do I dare?"      
Time to turn back and descend the stair,      
With a bald spot in the middle of my hair—              40
[They will say: "How his hair is growing thin!"]      
My morning coat, my collar mounting firmly to the chin,      
My necktie rich and modest, but asserted by a simple pin—      
[They will say: "But how his arms and legs are thin!"]      
Do I dare              45
Disturb the universe?      
In a minute there is time      
For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.      

For I have known them all already, known them all:—      
Have known the evenings, mornings, afternoons,              50
I have measured out my life with coffee spoons;      
I know the voices dying with a dying fall      
Beneath the music from a farther room.      
 So how should I presume?      

And I have known the eyes already, known them all—              55
The eyes that fix you in a formulated phrase,      
And when I am formulated, sprawling on a pin,      
When I am pinned and wriggling on the wall,      
Then how should I begin      
To spit out all the butt-ends of my days and ways?              60
 And how should I presume?      

And I have known the arms already, known them all—      
Arms that are braceleted and white and bare      
[But in the lamplight, downed with light brown hair!]      
It is perfume from a dress              65
That makes me so digress?      
Arms that lie along a table, or wrap about a shawl.      
 And should I then presume?      
 And how should I begin?
     .      .      .      .      .      
Shall I say, I have gone at dusk through narrow streets              70
And watched the smoke that rises from the pipes      
Of lonely men in shirt-sleeves, leaning out of windows?...      

I should have been a pair of ragged claws      
Scuttling across the floors of silent seas.
     .      .      .      .      .      
And the afternoon, the evening, sleeps so peacefully!              75
Smoothed by long fingers,      
Asleep ... tired ... or it malingers,      
Stretched on the floor, here beside you and me.      
Should I, after tea and cakes and ices,      
Have the strength to force the moment to its crisis?              80
But though I have wept and fasted, wept and prayed,      
Though I have seen my head [grown slightly bald] brought in upon a platter,      
I am no prophet—and here's no great matter;      
I have seen the moment of my greatness flicker,      
And I have seen the eternal Footman hold my coat, and snicker,              85
And in short, I was afraid.      

And would it have been worth it, after all,      
After the cups, the marmalade, the tea,      
Among the porcelain, among some talk of you and me,      
Would it have been worth while,              90
To have bitten off the matter with a smile,      
To have squeezed the universe into a ball      
To roll it toward some overwhelming question,      
To say: "I am Lazarus, come from the dead,      
Come back to tell you all, I shall tell you all"—              95
If one, settling a pillow by her head,      
 Should say: "That is not what I meant at all.      
 That is not it, at all."      

And would it have been worth it, after all,      
Would it have been worth while,              100
After the sunsets and the dooryards and the sprinkled streets,      
After the novels, after the teacups, after the skirts that trail along the floor—      
And this, and so much more?—      
It is impossible to say just what I mean!      
But as if a magic lantern threw the nerves in patterns on a screen:              105
Would it have been worth while      
If one, settling a pillow or throwing off a shawl,      
And turning toward the window, should say:      
 "That is not it at all,      
 That is not what I meant, at all."
     .      .      .      .      .              110
No! I am not Prince Hamlet, nor was meant to be;      
Am an attendant lord, one that will do      
To swell a progress, start a scene or two,      
Advise the prince; no doubt, an easy tool,      
Deferential, glad to be of use,              115
Politic, cautious, and meticulous;      
Full of high sentence, but a bit obtuse;      
At times, indeed, almost ridiculous—      
Almost, at times, the Fool.      

I grow old ... I grow old ...              120
I shall wear the bottoms of my trousers rolled.      

Shall I part my hair behind? Do I dare to eat a peach?      
I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.      
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each.      

I do not think that they will sing to me.              125

I have seen them riding seaward on the waves      
Combing the white hair of the waves blown back      
When the wind blows the water white and black.      

We have lingered in the chambers of the sea      
By sea-girls wreathed with seaweed red and brown              130
Till human voices wake us, and we drown.


Absolutely lovely!

[Mr. T.]

Here's some more depressing (but beautiful) poetry. This one's by Giacomo Leopardi:


Now be forever still,
Weary my heart. For the last cheat is dead,
I thought eternal. Dead. For us, I know
Not only the dear hope
Of being deluded gone, but the desire.
Rest still forever. You
Have beaten long enough. And to no purpose
Were all your stirrings; earth not worth your sighs.
Boredom and bitterness
Is life; and the rest, nothing; the world is dirt.
Lie quiet now. Despair
For the last time. Fate granted to our kind
Only to die. And now you may despise
Yourself, nature, the brute
Power which, hidden, ordains the common doom,
And all the immeasurable emptiness of things

 :'(


;D

[dragonboy]

Nothing quite as deep as Face's & Mr T's contributions, I love Wendy Cope's poems.
I shall to see if I can't find a couple to post...

Going back to books nothing has really grabbed me in a while, I must be a quarter of a way into 4 or 5 books right now  :-/

[megisnotreal]

not that i don't adore eliot or anything,but....

this is the most beautiful thing ever written. ever.




A child said What is the grass? fetching it to me with full hands;
How could I answer the child? I do not know what it is any more than he.

I guess it must be the flag of my disposition, out of hopeful green stuff woven.

Or I guess it is the handkerchief of the Lord,
A scented gift and remembrancer designedly dropt,
Bearing the owner's name someway in the corners, that we may see and remark, and say Whose?
Or I guess the grass is itself a child, the produced babe of the vegetation.

Or I guess it is a uniform hieroglyphic,
And it means, Sprouting alike in broad zones and narrow zones,
Growing among black folks as among white,
Kanuck, Tuckahoe, Congressman, Cuff, I give them the same, I receive them the same.

And now it seems to me the beautiful uncut hair of graves.

Tenderly will I use you curling grass,
It may be you transpire from the breasts of young men,
It may be if I had known them I would have loved them.
It may be you are from old people, or from offspring taken soon out of their mothers' laps,
And here you are the mothers' laps.

This grass is very dark to be from the white heads of old mothers.
Darker than the colorless beards of old men,
Dark to come from under the faint red roofs of mouths.

O I perceive after all so many uttering tongues,
And I perceive they do not come from the roofs of mouths for nothing.

I wish I could translate the hints about the dead young men and women,
And the hints about old men and mothers, and the offspring taken soon out of their laps.

What do you think has become of the young and old men?
And what do you think has become of the women and children?

They are alive and well somewhere,
The smallest sprout shows there is really no death,
And if ever there was it led forward life, and does not wait at the end to arrest it,
And ceas'd the moment life appear'd.

All goes onward and outward, nothing collapses,
And to die is different from what any one supposed, and luckier.

[IHL]

'Dispatches' by Michael Herr

A quality book if you haven't read it.

Prior to that, 'Trout Fishing in America' by Richard Brautigan - just bizarre (but in a good way)

[MMJ_fanatic]

Currently reading "Bringing Down The House" about the MIT blackjack team.  Kevin Spacey bought the movie rights and it is currently filming.  Even if you're not into gambling/poker/casinos this is a great story!  

[Jenny]

Man's Search for Meaning
by Viktor E. Frankl
(An Introduction to Logotherapy)

I don't want to put this down...

[bethofftherecord]

How did I miss this thread?

Currently reading:

Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil by John Berendt

I've been meaning to read it for years and am finally checking it off my list.  

I read compulsively, so I have to read like 4-8 books at the same time or else I will read a book cover to cover, not eat, just sit and read.  So, I am also reading:

Tragedy and Farce: How the American Media Sells Wars, Spins Elections, and Destroys Democracy by John Nichols and Bob McChesney

Creative Visualization by Shakti Gawain - rereading it over and over

Like Water for Chocolate by Laura Esquivel

and some nonfiction books on Organic Gardening, Yoga, and how to figure out what you want to do for a career.  I like to read.   [smiley=wink.gif]

[pawpaw]

I'd been studying for my PE (Engineering licensing test) from January to mid-April, so reading for fun was not an option...and I love to read. Since I got my free time back, I've been digging into Lonesome Dove. If you like Westerns, or at least the idea of them, or if you love non-pretentious, deceptively brilliant writing, read this book. It is so good.

[dragonboy]

I just learned that Sean Penn has made a movie starring Emile Hirsch & Vince Vaughn based upon Jon Krakauer's Into The Wild, a true story about a young man who packs in everything to go & live in Alaska. Excellent book, anybody else read it?
Book: http://www.amazon.com/Into-Wild-Jon-Krakauer/dp/0385486804/ref=pd_bbs_2/102-8829547-7261726?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1179231989&sr=1-2
Movie: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0758758/

[MMJ_fanatic]

I read the story about that guy but not that particular book.  It was kind of a wierd story--he ends up being poisoned by eating wild potato seeds mistakenly, if I remember correctly, and passes away alone in the Alaskan wilderness.  I guess if I had to pick a place to croak in isolation that would be my choice.

[dragonboy]

Great job Fanatic, now on one needs to bother reading the book or seeing the movie  :-/

[ali]

I just learned that Sean Penn has made a movie starring Emile Hirsch & Vince Vaughn based upon Jon Krakauer's Into The Wild, a true story about a young man who packs in everything to go & live in Alaska. Excellent book, anybody else read it?
Book: http://www.amazon.com/Into-Wild-Jon-Krakauer/dp/0385486804/ref=pd_bbs_2/102-8829 547-7261726?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1179231989&sr=1-2
Movie: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0758758/

i've read part of a book JK wrote about everest, which was really good, and i've been looking for his book about the eiger... yet to track that one down

current reading: (slight disclaimer here - yes, i know i am a nerd... no need to point it out)
the english civil war - dianne purkiss
rubicon (about the roman republic) -
a dying light in cordoba - lindsey davis
the devil in amber - mark gatiss (of league of gentlemen fame)
metro girl - janet evanovich (got to have a bit of chicklit in there to balance the nerdy stuff)

recently bought a book about bradford washburn, american photographer & adventurer, but haven't had time to get started on it yet

[colleen]

I'm glad to get some book recommendations from you folks. Have been really lazy about reading lately, but just started Love in the Western World by Denis De Rougemont. It explores the psychology of love from the legend of Tristan and Isolde to Hollywood and through mythology addresses the inevitable conflict (in the west) between marriage and passion. So far it's a really worthwhile read that explains a lot about the cultural biases and personal struggles most of us in the West wrestle with in this area of life.

[Chills]

Last one was No Country For Old Men by Cormac McCarthy.  I can't recommend it highly  enough.

The Coen brothers are adapting this one for a movie if I'm not mistaken.
So I guess it should be a good read  :)


Meanwhile, I can recommend this short, but oh so beautiful novel by the Japanese master Haruki Murakami.  




I'm very excited about this man, his breakthrough novel "Norwegian Wood" is next in line.

[bowl of soup]

I just learned that Sean Penn has made a movie starring Emile Hirsch & Vince Vaughn based upon Jon Krakauer's Into The Wild, a true story about a young man who packs in everything to go & live in Alaska. Excellent book, anybody else read it?
Book: http://www.amazon.com/Into-Wild-Jon-Krakauer/dp/0385486804/ref=pd_bbs_2/102-8829547-7261726?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1179231989&sr=1-2
Movie: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0758758/

This is best book ever - a life changer and a must read for everyone.  Short, to the point, without passing judgment, and it somehow manages to build incredible tension despite the horific outcome being literally printed on the cover.  To me this book compares to the groundbreaking Night by Elie Wiesel in that it's a contemplation on the value of life.  Just a gripping book.  There's just no way that Vince Vaugh is Chris McCandless though, no way.  I'm an idiot - just checked your link and indeed Vince Vaughn is not Chris McCandless; so I was right.

Currently reading Freakonomics and loving it - cheating teachers, comparing the KKK to real estate agents, and legalized abortion leading to a drop in the crime rate - all in there and more.

[MarkW]

Currently reading Freakonomics and loving it - cheating teachers, comparing the KKK to real estate agents, and legalized abortion leading to a drop in the crime rate - all in there and more.

Freakonomics is a good read.

I'm about halfway through The Long March, by E L Doctorow.  Excellent novel set in the American civil war.  The opening chapter is as good as any I've ever read.

[bowl of soup]

Excerpt of Into the Wild:

http://outside.away.com/outside/features/1993/1993_into_the_wild_1.html

[Jenny]

Tao Te Ching (Lao Tsu)

[red]

Last one was No Country For Old Men by Cormac McCarthy.  I can't recommend it highly  enough.

Picked that up from the library this afternoon, can't wait to start it.